[WITHDRAWN] Petition to the Admin Team

Crushing Our Enemies

Crushing Our Enemies

TNPer
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Discord
COE#7110
Below is a petition to the admin team signed by a number of TNPers. This thread is for discussion of the petition, new signatures, and (hopefully) a response from the admin team. If you would like to sign the petition, you may do so by posting in this thread indication that wish to sign, and including name of your TNP nation. The 23 petitioners are listed in alphabetical order.

<The Petition has been withdrawn. Below is a list of the signatories at the time it was withdrawn. The goal of the petition was to remove Punk D from the admin team and bring about a change in admin policy that would result in more confidence from the forum community going forward.>

  1. Abacathea
  2. Abbey Anumia (BouncyAbbeyKitty)
  3. Aneurin (Aurora orb)
  4. Blue Wolf II
  5. Crushing Our Enemies (General COE)
  6. Elkhorn_6 (Jagerton)
  7. Gladio
  8. Isimud
  9. Leekem
  10. Lord Ravenclaw
  11. Malashaan (Malashaan TNP)
  12. Mall
  13. North East Somerset (HMS Falmouth)
  14. Nydna (Partambula)
  15. r3naissanc3r (HMS Unicorn)
  16. Sanctaria Sanctarian WA Mission
  17. Schweizweld
  18. SillyString
  19. TED 4355
  20. The Democratic Republic of Tomb
  21. Treize Dreizehn (Dueling Cardsharps)
  22. Zyvetskistaahn
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I would like to make a few things clear from the start:

First, this has nothing to do with Punk's gameplay alignment. This is not an anti-defender petition. If Punk D was a raider, the same grievances would apply, since the NPA defends as well. No one here has a problem with having a defender-affiliated administrator. I personally think that Eluvatar was a superb admin, and if he were able, I'd like to see him be admin here indefinitely. The problem with Punk being admin is not that he is a defender. Our grievance is that he is not a TNPer, and his best interests do not necessarily align with those of the region.

Second, I think Punk has been doing a very good job as admin. He's active, responsive, and gets stuff done. But it's not his job to do. There are plenty of people who could be a good admin who also have a nation in TNP and have made a formal commitment to our regional security. The administration team of the TNP forum ought to be made up of TNPers.

EDIT: In case anyone was wondering, this is not an April Fool's joke >_> Sorry, bad timing.
 
I don't really care that he has no nation here, that is a trivial distinction. You said yourself, he does an excellent job as an admin, and that is all that really matters.

I have also been informed that this is not the first backroom effort to have Punk D removed, and that twice this group was told to address Punk D directly, or at least bring their complaints publicly. It is nice to see that these conspirators have finally found the courage to come forward, even if it was prompted by Gracius Maximus' post in the RA. I, sarcastically, applaud COE's effort to get out in front of his effort and try to manage perception after the fact. This whole endeavor seems highly manipulative, and more petty than the originators would care to admit. I would take one Punk D over ten of the signatories any day of the week. (and Treize Dreizehn? You don't want him in the RA, but are more than willing to have his input on board administration?)

Again, he is an admin, and does a good job. Maybe you would like to elucidate the real reason why you want Punk D removed.

Edit: I recall a long time where I was a Global Mod on this board without maintaining a nation in game. It wasn't a problem then for the same reason it isn't a problem today; moderation of the board is deliberately separate from the day to day politics of the region.
 
Democratic Donkeys:
I don't really care that he has no nation here, that is a trivial distinction. You said yourself, he does an excellent job as an admin, and that is all that really matters.
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Ability to do the work of an admin is not all that matters. The position of admin is a position of trust, and thus the trust of the forum community matters as well. There is a lot on this forum that's not meant to go beyond this community, and while I'm not accusing punk of anything now, or in the near future, as long as he remains outside the community and maintaining other commitments in NS, he is a potential security risk. Maybe not this year, or the next, but the potential is there.

Democratic Donkeys:
I have also been informed that this is not the first backroom effort to have Punk D removed, and that twice this group was told to address Punk D directly, or at least bring their complaints publicly.
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This is factually incorrect. There has never been I have never been involved in an attempt to have Punk D removed before this petition. There has been some displeasure expressed with Punk D being admin from the beginning, and the subject has come up from time to time on the public IRC channel for this region. A message was passed from Punk encouraging a public discussion, and that was the impetus for this petition.

Democratic Donkeys:
It is nice to see that these conspirators have finally found the courage to come forward, even if it was prompted by Gracius Maximus' post in the RA. I, sarcastically, applaud COE's effort to get out in front of his effort and try to manage perception after the fact. This whole endeavor seems highly manipulative, and more petty than the originators would care to admit.
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This is not a conspiracy; it is a petition. Petitions are useless if they're not posted, so I'm not sure what you thought the plan was, if not this.

Democratic Donkeys:
Again, he is an admin, and does a good job. Maybe you would like to elucidate the real reason why you want Punk D removed.
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Being an admin does not make one suited to being an admin, and doing a good job is not the only thing that matters. The reasons I and the other petitioners want Punk D removed are detailed in the petition.
 
As I signed this petition, I would like to add a comment on my own reasoning for it. Note that I am going to shorten "Administration and Moderation" to the simpler, "Admins". I am, in general, referring to both with that word.

I wholeheartedly support the idea that TNP admins ought to be TNPers. That's what keeps them accountable to the community, and what guides their actions and decision-making processes. There are lots of NSers who would make great admins - Westwind is a good admin, as is Lord Ravenclaw, as is Hileville, as is Todd McCloud. Time permitting, any of them could be trusted to act reasonably, do what needed to get done, and keep an eye out for the security of the forum.

But there's a reason we don't ask these people to be our admins - there's a reason we pull from within ourselves.[note]I am aware Raven and Hile are both members of the RA, and I do not intend with this to diminish either their contributions or loyalty to TNP. I chose them because their primary activity and widely-known association has generally lain elsewhere - Osiris for Raven, and TSP for Hile - and we do not go courting people to become admins simply because they are good at it.[/note] It's not that any of them would get up to evil and nefarious acts, but that we as a region rely on the bonds of community and accountability to maintain a strong relationship between the region at large and the admin team.

New players coming to TNP don't know who's who. They don't know anything about other players except what they can observe around the region. And when the admin team is heavily integrated into the community, they see that. They can get to know the admins as players, not just authority figures, and witness first hand the way admins separate (or fail to separate) their actions as players from their responsibilities as admins. Seeing admins act this way consistently builds trust that they will continue to do so.

When admins are not part of TNP - when their NS affiliations lie entirely elsewhere - that is worrying. They create no relationships with other members through day-to-day government functioning, but rather exist in TNP solely as authority figures. They remask, they warn, they ban. They are aloof. And that existence does nothing to maintain or further the trust that has built up between TNP and TNP admins - trust which is necessary for the relationship between the two to function at all.

I would differentiate this, moreover, from other cases of less-than-involved admins. An admin who no longer has the time to play NS actively but continues to putter around the forum doing odd-jobs is, by these very actions, demonstrating their continuing commitment to, and care for, TNP - they are doing what they can, much as someone who doesn't have time to run for office is still doing what they can when they comment on legislation before the RA. An admin in this scenario is quite different from someone who has the time for NS, and who uses their time to play NS, but devotes it and their loyalty entirely to other regions or organizations. In that case, maintenance of an admin position is much more likely to be due to enjoying the power that comes with it, and not any particular loyalty to the community in question.

TNP admins should be TNPers - I don't think this is an outrageous suggestion.
 
SillyString:
TNP admins should be TNPers - I don't think this is an outrageous suggestion.
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I think it is outrageous to suggest that even if Punk were to move a nation here that it would not satisfy this group. That is part of why I wonder what the real reason is. You can hide behind high-minded principles if you like, but don't expect everyone to be beguiled by the load of caca you are peddling.
 
If all punk d did to allay our concerns was move nation to TNP, that would not be satisfying because, as you yourself pointed out, it is a "trivial distinction." What matters is commitment to the region. If punk were to rejoin the region and get involved again, or were to withdraw from other NS commitments as he has withdrawn from TNP, that would be something.
 
I will just point out for now that the actual root admin account is held by a long time TNP who retired from the game years ago.
There is no concrete evidence that this presented a problem, and arrangements have been in place for years to assure access to that account.
There is no logical connection between being an admin and exercising objectivity in their decision and requiring current in game activity as a "citizen." In fact, a retired player who has a long connection with the region actually means a enhanced level of acting fairly and objectively as an admin (or a global mod) for that matter, and that is a beneficial characteristic in an admin.
We have never imposed a citizenship requirement, but we have imposed a forum activity history of service and the latter can exist without being a political "citizen." A R.A. membership requirement would be even worse because it would demand the very thing we set out to avoid even before the community moved here from Old Blue -- a blending of the role of the admin team with the in game and offsite gameplay.
Therefore I am, and have been philosophically opposed to such a requirement.
 
Democratic Donkeys:
I think it is outrageous to suggest that even if Punk were to move a nation here that it would not satisfy this group. That is part of why I wonder what the real reason is. You can hide behind high-minded principles if you like, but don't expect everyone to be beguiled by the load of caca you are peddling.
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Punk was elected to a position, abandoned his duties, and then deliberately walked away from all aspects of TNP except his admin position. That in and of itself demonstrates a shocking lack of commitment to the region, and to the community.

It's not at all duplicitous to say that simply moving a nation into TNP and reclaiming citizenship is insufficient to be happy with Punk as an admin. Given that his previous actions clearly point to only being interested in maintaining his adminship, any such citizenship would similarly fail to demonstrate any commitment to the region - it would be entirely based on keeping his power. Why is there any surprise that this is an issue in and of itself?

Having citizenship is not the sole prerequisite for being part of the TNP community, and holding it while failing to interact with the community as a player - while doing so in more than one outside region/organization! - does nothing to alleviate concerns about loyalty or about trust.

Citizenship ought to be necessary, but it is certainly not sufficient.

Edit: Grosse, please see my previous comment about less-than-active admins. People who dedicate what little time they have for NS to adminning TNP are demonstrating commitment and connection to the community. People who devote lots of time to NS but none to TNP proper are doing the opposite.
 
Thank you. this petition will be given all the serious consideration it merits.

Since the main point seems to be the fear that PunkD will betray the region's secrets to a foreign power, please could you post any evidence, rumour, or anything that would lead one to the conclusion that this is what PunkD has done or intends to do?

I would add that for many years the senior admin on the TNP forum was Ananke, whose military allegiance was elsewhere, and whose sole involvement in TNP (apart from maintaining a token nation) was as admin.

Folks have been after PunkD's scalp since the moment he was announced as admin. I was told he would do a crappy, biased job. In fact, he has been exemplary.

The case of the signatories of the petition would be much stronger if you would post evidence rather than supposition and scare-mongering.
 
My response to this could be summed up in one word:

Disappointed.

I'm not disappointed about the concerns raised by this group. I think it's reasonable to ask, "if someone is not part of government can they administrate these forums securely? If they are part of a Defender organization can they be trusted with our data?" I think that's a fair question.

But I do believe it a bit disingenuous to state that the first time this has become an issue was due to my involvement with LRI. If you look at some of the posts on admin-only threads you'll see that McM brought the issue initially to the admins some time ago well before I decided to create LRI.

The petition also assumes a great deal about me without ever asking anything. For instance, the petition assumes that if given the choice between LRI and administering this board - if I were forced to make such a choice - I'd choose to continue LRI. The petitioners never once, repeat, not once did they ask this question.

The petition also speaks about interests in TNP. When I retired, I wanted to remain an admin. I asked the admin team that question prior to retiring. Honestly, if they had said I needed to maintain a nation in TNP to continue as admin. I would. The reason being is I have a significant vested interest in the TNP community. I enjoy the different personalities here but I retired from an exhaustion and lack of motivation from a game side. From a board administration perspective I wanted to continue to be a part of a really great admin team and help keep the wheels moving along. Unfettered from game entanglements, it was pretty easy and fun to do. Not being able to read private RA threads sucked and as I've mentioned before I really would have loved to have been part of the Empire of Narnia conversation. But, I am committed to this community and am disappointed the petitioners just didn't ask me this.

My account is nearly 10 years old. I was passed over on being an admin at least twice before. I am humbled and honored to be in this role and take it very seriously. I just wish that this group would have reached out to me versus using this method.

Instead, the petition seems to reek - and I could be wrong - of an attempt to remove Punk D from an admin role simply because I am Punk D. There have been times where we had Global Mods and admins that weren't in the RA at the same time they were admins and global mods. It's been fluid for sure. That's why the focus on myself seems a bit strange.

I am happy to answer any questions members of our community would like to ask. I just wish the petitioners would have chosen to ask them months ago.
 
I can certainly say from this perspective that I didn't put my name on this petition because of your involvement with LRI. At all. It didn't even factor into my thought processes. I expressed when you stepped away from the region that I thought it innappropriate for you to remain as admin but speaking to people in this manner is something that I find hard and I approached it how I felt was best at the time.

You surely must appreciate how it appears to us that you don't care about TNP, that your interests in NS are very much elsewhere and all the other criticisms levied in this petition. While I accept that you're highly unlikely to actually betray the region, when you're showing very little active commitment to TNP that's very hard to gauge or say for certain.

And "It's happened before" isn't a reason for it to happen now. I dissagree that it should happen - and as has been argued above, there's a difference between "Not a lot of time for NS, spending what little they have doing TNP adminning" and "Plenty of time for NS, but doing nothing in TNP except Adminning."

Admins are fundamentally part of our region, or they should be. It's not a personal attack or an attack on you, punk, but simply saying that we dissagree that you should be an admin when you're showing little to no interest in TNP.
 
Abbey – first thank you for taking the time to reply.

I think when the petition uses language that talks about LRI, one can only assume that it factors into people's thoughts. Thank you for specifying that it didn’t for you.

When you say my interests do not lie in TNP that’s something that doesn’t resonate with me. When I retired, I sought to retain this position because this community matters to me. I’m unsure if because I’m no longer a “citizen” if that means I don’t care about the community but from my perspective membership in the RA does not mean you care about or have an interest in a community.

I suppose I could have just left myself as a citizen, but I will need for you to explain your thoughts on interest when for me I’m fully invested in the community. I have simply chosen not to take part in the government any longer.

I hope that clarifies my position a bit further.

Edit Below
Edit: Grosse, please see my previous comment about less-than-active admins. People who dedicate what little time they have for NS to adminning TNP are demonstrating commitment and connection to the community. People who devote lots of time to NS but none to TNP proper are doing the opposite.
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Just saw the above quote. What about people who devote lots of time to adminning TNP and lots of time elsewhere? Eluvatar comes to mind when he was active. I think he was admin of a number of boards while being an admin here. I don't recall the same questions around his involvement. What was the difference?
 
Just to keep everyone in the loop, this is being discussed considered by the administration team.

Edit: Happy now?
 
Crushing Our Enemies:
This is factually incorrect. There has never been an attempt to have Punk D removed before this petition.
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This depends on what you define as "attempt". there has certainly been lobbying. I cannot speak for other admins, but Eluvatar and myself have certainly been lobbied to remove PunkD. I was approached the very day I remasked him - and this was while he was still active politically in TNP and serving in the government (or perhaps court system, I forget which).
 
No. Displeasure expressed is "I do not like this"

What I got was "please change your mind and remove his masking".
 
I would just like to say that I have absolutely nothing against Punk D nor the fact that he is LRI, he has done a very good job as a forum administrator and has been one of the more active ones aswell. I just think It would be good if the admin team adopted a policy where It would require administrators to have a nation in The North Pacific, and maintain an appropriate level of interest in our regional security.
 
Along the same lines of what Abbey had said, my "signing" of this petition has no reflection on the type of person you are, as I obviously do not know you. My name appears on the list for the simple reason that you no longer have a nation in TNP. I was completely unaware of any tidings you had in other regions or what you have done in the past, therefore none of those items had any sort of consideration in my decision.

I just wanted to clarify this to you.
 
SillyString:
Edit: Grosse, please see my previous comment about less-than-active admins. People who dedicate what little time they have for NS to adminning TNP are demonstrating commitment and connection to the community. People who devote lots of time to NS but none to TNP proper are doing the opposite.
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The problem with your position is, as I noted before, the attempt to blend the political with the need for the admin and global mods (in particular) and all of those with moderation responsibilities to act in an fair, objective and non-partisan way.

We set upon this course when we realized during the Pixiedance era that allowing an overlap of these two positions was not in the best interests of the forum community, and the resolve to separate the two has been consistent since then. While none of this has been done perfectly, we've tried to be as consistent as possible with this approach.

I simply do not believe that a mandated "citizenshiP" or even an "RA Membership" requirement is in the best interests of the forum community. Once such a requirement were to be put in place, the next step would be subjugation of the admin and moderation team to the political winds of the moment, as the removal of a user from the citizenship oe god forbid, the RA if a membership requirement were to be put in place would have such a consequence. The comment in your post to DD implies this in your comment that requiring citizenship is not enough. I'm not a fool and I know better than to let a comment like that pass.

It is one of the reasons why the constitution recognized the independence of the forum administration team, and this petition fails to take this principled position that arose from our experience as a community into account.
 
Honestly, I don't think that forum administration must necessarily entail current involvement in the affairs of TNP gameplay-wise. Forum administration serves one purpose and one purpose only: to control the affairs of the offsite forum. It should be a depoliticised role, and really TNP membership or involvement should not be the primary factor.
 
Grosseschnauzer:
The problem with your position is, as I noted before, the attempt to blend the political with the need for the admin and global mods (in particular) and all of those with moderation responsibilities to act in an fair, objective and non-partisan way.

We set upon this course when we realized during the Pixiedance era that allowing an overlap of these two positions was not in the best interests of the forum community, and the resolve to separate the two has been consistent since then.
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What are you talking about? Under the Pixiedance era we realized that someone who was, and I must place emphasis, Delegate should not be an Admin during their time in that position, that's why every Delegate who ever held an Admin position stepped down for their entire term. Well, everyone except one exception: Grosseschnauzer, who refused to step down as Admin while delegate, being the only person since Pixiedance to hold both. That long held and sensible tradition then immediately died.

If there is anyone who is absolutely not qualified to lecture on about the importance of separating politics and Admin work, it's most certainly him, but I digress.

The implication that is being seen here is that the current active members of TNP, who hold a stake in the region and it's day to day actives, are either not trustworthy enough or not competent enough to hold an Admin position and thus we must give the position to people who are no longer involved in the community. I find that suggestion to be insulting and untrue.
 
punk d:
Edit: Grosse, please see my previous comment about less-than-active admins. People who dedicate what little time they have for NS to adminning TNP are demonstrating commitment and connection to the community. People who devote lots of time to NS but none to TNP proper are doing the opposite.
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Just saw the above quote. What about people who devote lots of time to adminning TNP and lots of time elsewhere? Eluvatar comes to mind when he was active. I think he was admin of a number of boards while being an admin here. I don't recall the same questions around his involvement. What was the difference?
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I cannot think of a time in my knowledge where Eluvatar has been active in NS and not active in TNP - that's a third case that's also separate from "not active in NS" and "active in NS but not in TNP".

It's true that being an admin on multiple forums does open the possibility for abuse, but so does simply being an admin at all. Eluvatar, specifically, has consistently shown by his actions that his loyalty to TNP is unshakeable - the incident with members of the UDL spying on the NPA comes to mind as a clear example - and when he can be active, he spends a fair amount of time on TNP matters and interacting with other TNPers. He also, as Wolf has alluded to, voluntarily stepped down as admin while serving in the delegacy, because of his deep commitment to administration separation from regional government.[note]I would note that separation from government is quite distinct from separation from community. This is not about politics. I signed the petition because I believe the adoption of such a policy by the admins would be the best thing for the community.[/note]

Or, in other words, he actively maintains and nurtures the trust that the community has placed in him, insofar as he is capable of doing so.
 
Blue Wolf II:
flemingovia:
Just to keep everyone in the loop, this is being discussed by the administration team.
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Yeah, but not being considered.
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Apologies for the double post, but if this is true, it's actually quite worrisome. 23 members of the community voicing their support for a policy isn't sufficient to merit consideration?

I expected better. :no:
 
SillyString:
Blue Wolf II:
flemingovia:
Just to keep everyone in the loop, this is being discussed by the administration team.
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Yeah, but not being considered.
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Apologies for the double post, but if this is true, it's actually quite worrisome. 23 members of the community voicing their support for a policy isn't sufficient to merit consideration?

I expected better. :no:
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No. It's not true. It is just shit stirring.

As I said in my opening post, this will be consideredby the admin team. If you think it will not, then it sounds as if you have issues with the integrity of the whole team, not just punkd.

I expected better :no:
 
flemingovia:
As I said in my opening post, this will be consideredby the admin team.
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Do you mean this comment?

this petition will be given all the serious consideration it merits.
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Not terribly reassuring. Exactly how much consideration does this merit, in your opinion?
 
Some of the petitioners talk about trust. Will one of the petitioners answer one question for me: why did you feel it was inappropriate to ask me directly about your concerns? What about a direct process did you not trust would address your concerns?

I hope that someone will answer this but I do want to add to what I think Flem stated in that many of the folks putting forth the petition today are the same folks who while I was a member of TNP did not want me to be an admin for other reasons (I assume) not listed in the OP. I hope you will find it worth to answer this for me and as I have stated before, I will answer any concerns from the community.

The community's trust that I will perform my duties to the best of my abilities is of the utmost importance to me. However, if the community has concerns but does not raise them to me how can I address them or know them.

Thank you.
PD
 
punk d:
Some of the petitioners talk about trust. Will one of the petitioners answer one question for me: why did you feel it was inappropriate to ask me directly about your concerns? What about a direct process did you not trust would address your concerns?
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I can answer this from my perspective - I assume others will also have their own reasons.

To paraphrase what I wrote in the private RA thread, the process which COE followed guarantees safety to its participants - either anonymity, if their numbers are insufficient to warrant publicity, or the protection of a group, if there are enough to want to come forward.

Posts like this one and this one are exactly the reason I - and I'm sure others - would have stayed away from any such petition had it been posted in public from the beginning. It, and everyone who signed it, are called manipulative, cowardly, petty, and conspiring. The petition is deemed a publicity stunt with an ominous hidden agenda, by people who are largely worthless. There is no other way to take posts of this type - the only small safety from attacks of this nature is in not being isolated.

If I did not already know that 22 other TNPers, at minimum, supported the principle that TNP admins should be TNPers, I would probably not have felt comfortable coming forward myself. And in fact, you can see that I didn't feel safe doing so, as I did not myself open a thread to discuss the matter. Who would, when they face attacks on their character merely for standing up and speaking their mind?

This risk is amplified for others - for newer members, to whom established members will always be daunting, and who might be afraid of their position on a non-political issue damaging their political futures in the region. For shyer members, who find direct conflict stressful. For appointed deputies, who might worry about facing dismissal if the official who appointed them came out as vitriolic as DD has. These are genuine risks, and genuine fears.

In terms of talking to you individually... because this issue is bigger than you. Even if you were to resign from the admin team or to reestablish citizenship/membership in the community, that wouldn't change the desire that this petition expresses for a change in overall admin policy. It concerns the admins as a whole.
 
I'd warrant that if the mandated citizenship is held for every other position (including average joe) why wouldn't it be for someone capable of viewing the entire board? I can't speak of reputations or such as I'm new to TNP, but with that being said the rules and policies should be universally spanning.
 
I say what I feel, directly and for all to see. I welcome people to dismiss it as pure opinion, to disagree in response, or tell me "fuck you" if I deserve it. I won't hide my dislike of someone behind superficial reasons. I'm not at all sorry to disagree with you and everyone on that list, and to be so "vitriolic", but there is a subtext to this whole petition that is demeaning and frankly insulting. Punk D has served this region well as an admin, as the petition is quite clear to point out.

Also, those new people have no institutional memory, and are responsive to the admittedly reasonable superficial argument, but have no idea the petty history that lurks behind it.
 
In such a heavy topic why would you be picking petty fights? This is a serious matter. Does it bode well to act like a child to the entire region? I can sympathize with you being angry at your opinion challenged but please don't allow it to disrupt your professional demeor.
 
I was going to stay out of this topic and not touch it with a ten foot pole as I am still relatively new here. This seems like some sort of pissing contest by the veteran TNPers and I was going to be a sideline watcher. When I got PMd as I am sure a lot of people did about signing this thing. My first thought was "I am not getting involved in this drama" my 2nd thought was "I have only been here a month from what I can tell Punk D is doing a great job"

I mean no disrespect to COE or the petetioners, I can understand where they are coming from, wanting someone active in the region as a forum administrator, wanting to make sure the people with admin powers who can see PMs and senstive areas of the forums have a vested intrests in the region and her security. I understand that and can sympathize.

For the record I only skimmed the OP and the PMs I got about this, but I have yet to see anything to suggest that Punk D doesnt have the intrests of the forum at heart. I understand the desire to want a TNPer who is active to be an administrator but I also feel it is the administrators job to be neutral calculating and strictly business so at the same time it can be a good thing to have someone with no inside intrests who can do the job and make correct calls without bias getting in the way. So certianly the powers that be could make exceptions to allow those without nations or an active presence in TNP to be forum mods and admins and to be a neutral third party and carry out thier duties in good faith at the discretin of the admin staff until such a time trust is broken or whatever.

I have yet to see any thing to suggest punk D has violated any TNP trust. Futhermore I think punk D does a great job from what I can see. And until shown otherwise I think Punk D should ignore the critism and continue to work and be a great assest to the TNP forum admin team. TnP should be proud to have him serve the board.
 
As some have already said, my name is on the petition because Punk D has no nation in TNP and is not involved in any other way. In my opinion admins should have a certain level of activity in the region. I am not against Punk D as a person and did not sign because of some conspiracy against him. I made my decision based solely on what I considered best for the region.
 
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