OP-ED. WHO SHOULD GET YOUR VOTE AS DELEGATE?

Flemingovia

TNPer
-
-
Back in 1992, the British comedian Ben Elton lampooned the (then) current government by displaying a rack full of identical grey suits. The government were, he claimed, "suits full of bugger all" – carbon copy, grey, uninspiring, unmemorable.

Four Candidates have so far thrown their hats into the ring in the current delegate election in The North Pacific inspired, perhaps, by the fact that popular incumbent is prevented from running for an additional term. The candidates are: Romanoffia, Kiwi, Mall and Lennart.

Of the four, Mall stands out as distinctive. He is the Lutz candidate, standing on the platform of turning rogue, propped up by raider support and making the NPA a purely raider force. Current opinion in TNP is that Mall is unelectable on this current platform. A vote for Mall would be fun, but wasted. There is nothing much to add, apart from the worrying observation that the current deputy minister of defence, Gladio, has expressed “full support” for this platform. Hmmmm.

So let us turn to the other three candidates.
Of course, all the candidates would like to think of themselves as standing out from the pack. As Lennart says in his campaign thread, “But what I'm offering is something completely different”. But do any of them actually stand out? Careful reading of all three campaign threads show a lot of platitude, but little substance. All three are careful to position themselves in the centre ground, but make few specific promises and keep the ideology to the minimum.

Let’s examine two of the key issues in this election to see whether there is anything to distinguish the candidates:

Hanging on to the coat-tails of McMasterdonia.

Most of the candidates are keen to emphasise their appreciation of Mcmasterdonia, and their continuity from his tenure.

Lennart:
As you probably know, I wanted Mcm to run for a third term because I share his vision…
Kiwi:
If I'm honest, all I want to do is build on the foundations that McMasterdonia and other delegates before him have already put in place. Quite simply, if it ain't broke, don't try and fix it.
Romanoffia:
What I would probably do is to hold over the current Cabinet for a while

On IRC, Kiwi gave frankly the reason why candidates are keen to present themselves as the successor to McMasterdonia:

Kiwi:
<Kiwi>: People like what McM has done in his previous term. It would be silly to rock the boat too much. (quoted with permission)

It tends to be a truism that the visionary is succeeded by the bland. Thatcher was followed by Major, Reagan by Bush, Fergusson by Moyes. Blair gave way to Brown, Chrétien to Martin. As the British political commentator Jonathan Freedland comments “it is all but impossible for one star to follow another.” It is therefore perhaps the greatest tribute that could be paid to McMasterdonia’s term in office that those seeking to follow him seem content to occupy his long shadow.

Miliary Policy

Another big issue in this election is military policy, following recent criticism of the NPA’s leadership and policy. Is there anything to distinguish the candidates on future military policy? With the exception of Mall, not really. Again, they all claim to occupy a centre ground, which they perceive as popular with the electorate.

Lennart:
I have always considered myself to be neutral
Romanoffia:
I'm sort of neutral on the issue of the raider/defender 'sub-game'
Kiwi:
I have always believed that the NPA should be a neutral army.

When asked on IRC whether he felt that the NPA at the moment was currently occupying that centre ground, Kiwi was clear:

Kiwi:
Simply put, no. (quoted with permission)

Perhaps the clearest indicator as to whether the centrist aim will be seen out in practice in the next delegacy comes in the candidate’s preference for the key role of Minister of Defence.

Roman: Allies himself squarely with Blue Wolf’s Tyr's hand party. Wants to keep the current cabinet, so for now Blue Wolf would be Minister of Defence.
Lennart: Supports Tyr’s Hand policies. Would like McMasterdonia in defence.
Kiwi: Distances himself from party politics. Would like to have McM as minister of Defence, or Blue Wolf/Gladio in charge, "giv(ing) our leading Generals a bit more power to authorise missions."

So … who should we vote for?

In conclusion, There have been past TNP elections when there has been a clear and sharp choice between different ideologies. This election feels different, with each of the mainstream candidates seeking to occupy the middle ground, emphasise continuity, and make noises that accord with the prevailing regional sentiment.
It may be the best way to get elected in TNP at the moment, but is it the sort of visionary leadership TNP needs right now? Older hands can remember when the choice of Feeder was a choice of clear ideological preference. Now, you may as well put on a blindfold and stick a pin in. the same feels the case in the current TNP election.

So who should you vote for? Vote for Roman and you will get long quirky posts, Kiwi will probably give you the most balanced government, but does he have the cojones to stand up to the powerful lobbies in the region? Lennart promises most in the way of continuity, but is relatively inexperienced in government. .

One thing is clear. This commentator knows what the theme tune of the election will be. It can be no other than “No matter who you vote for, the government always gets in” By the Bonzo Dog Doo-Dah Band. Listen and enjoy:

heigh-ho, don’t worry, nobody can win
No matter who you vote for, the government always gets in.

[video]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CjJLTslWp_Q[/video]​
 
Indeed.

The NPA has moved raider and other than Mall the candidates want to move towards the center. This is despite their praise of McM and stated wish to not "rock the boat".

A vote for Mall may be wasted, but I'm giving it serious thought.
 
PaulWallLibertarian42:
After this. Im conflicted. Seriously thinking about writing flemingovia in as a write-in candidate.
This is a good choice.

Historically, Romanoffia has been more of a wildcard diplomatically than he gives himself credit for, perhaps intentionally. I believe Roman will rock the boat a bit, even if he is pandering to the prevailing winds at present. No, I do not believe he would ever go rogue, but I do think he would be different than the other two 'legitimate' candidates.
 
I would add that the last time I stepped down suddenly, the special election was similar with candidates advocating for a continuation of my government and style. I believe it was Cormac that strongly positioned himself as my successor, ultimately Jamie won that election and I think his campaign was framed similarly.

Many people have said that they have enjoyed having me as their Delegate and were supportive of my style and governance over the region. I have appreciated those comments. However I don't think they necessarily need to criticise me or say they disliked my style, to offer something different. This isn't what Flem is saying, but simply what I am saying to the candidates.

Don't be afraid to be bold. Put your ideas forward and lay them out for critique. Show your vision to the region. If you need help or advice - there are many people in the region you could ask who are seasoned campaigners. Go archive diving and take a look at the election campaigns of 2012 and 2013 - or even further back. My original campaign was very long and detailed and it gathered a lot of responses, including negative and argumentative ones. Nonetheless, I really enjoyed that campaign and I believe it was one of the major things that helped sweep me to victory.

At the end of the day, the election hasn't officially started yet. We don't yet know who may nominate when the nominations actually open. Lennart hasn't released his full campaign yet and is simply at the campaign rally stage. I expect the other candidates will also elaborate on other policy areas once the election really gets underway.
 
Well as we know now, Lennart has dropped out of the race. This makes the election a little more difficult, ironically. For people like me, Lennart provided a government we were comfortable with, one in which he advocated that is different from the rest and will be like Mcmasterdonia's. Now we are basically left with two candidates, who excel in the judicial part of the government. I believe this will constitute for a more centralized government, like the federalists, who believed the government should have more power over the states. I don't believe their ideologies are that different, for this reason. So I'm stuck on who to vote for now. We definitely do not want a Mall administration, but we also do not want a delegate who has been only experience in a certain part of the government, because that's the only experience they bring to the delegacy and it will show in their law proposals, whether its tightening up the courts ambiguities or making reforms to the army. Mcmasterdonia didn't have this problem, but I voted against him having a next term because, in my humble opinion, a change was needed. I asked him to host a debate between the candidates, so ultimately I believe the debate will be the deciding factor for most of TNP.
 
Thank you for the commentary! It is refreshing to see such an interest in our elections, instead of the usual seeming plod towards a shoe-in candidate. We'll still be doing so come election time, but at least we are talking about it. :D
 
PaulWallLibertarian42:
Leekem, why dont you take a run at it? If you so liked lennert take his enthusiam and run with it. Be the change you wish to see.
Paulwall, you came in with ideologies and enthusiasm, posting every minute you get and I like that. I do not wish the delegate seat and I know if I was to run I would lose by an unimaginable margin. I would like to run again for speaker, are you planning to run for speaker?
 
No. Mcm has appointed me an EC, to observe and help Grosse and Sanctaria, so I can see what its like behind the voting booth.

As such I cannot run for a position in this cycle. Nor am I intertested as such a time. Im happy being a deputy speaker and learning the ropes. I think Zyvet does a great job.

Though after DD joke-nominated me for AG, and I got a couple joke 2nds. Im not ruling out a fall AG nomination.
 
Leekem:
PaulWallLibertarian42:
Leekem, why dont you take a run at it? If you so liked lennert take his enthusiam and run with it. Be the change you wish to see.
Paulwall, you came in with ideologies and enthusiasm, posting every minute you get and I like that. I do not wish the delegate seat and I know if I was to run I would lose by an unimaginable margin. I would like to run again for speaker, are you planning to run for speaker?
Don't sell yourself short, I'm sure you could imagine it. :)
 
Ok, PaulWall. I think if the current speaker doesn't run or Olvern I will run again. I believe I'm the right person for the job but I've received strong criticism before.
DD, you've supported in my very first election and helped me win the special election for justice, for that I will be grateful but you've seen my elections and you've my average of votes, which makes me some speculation if I should make the attempt again.
 
Gracius Maximus:
PaulWallLibertarian42:
After this. Im conflicted. Seriously thinking about writing flemingovia in as a write-in candidate.
This is a good choice.

Historically, Romanoffia has been more of a wildcard diplomatically than he gives himself credit for, perhaps intentionally. I believe Roman will rock the boat a bit, even if he is pandering to the prevailing winds at present. No, I do not believe he would ever go rogue, but I do think he would be different than the other two 'legitimate' candidates.
Wild card, when needed. :P

Most people here know my style and know what I can accomplish by pulling a 'wild card' like talking directly to Gates to get his forces out of the region way back when. Everyone I went to with my plan said it wouldn't work. And precisely because I was told "it won't work" I said, "who's going to stop me from succeeding?" And best of all, Gates never saw that course of approach coming. Never assume anything is impossible and never assume any opponent cannot be reasonable. A wild card with a dash of Realpolitik judiciously applied in a well reasoned plan behind it usually has a better chance of success than doing the same old thing the same old way all the time.

The problem with foreign policy in this region is that it has been absolutely dull and predictable. That alone means that anyone you come up with in an adversarial manner knows exactly what you are going to do and exactly how you are going to do it. This of course means that anyone who wants to get one over on you can do so if they put their minds to it. Now, if there is the element of a wild card being played from time to time, it tends to baffle one's adversaries and thwart their nefarious plans. On the other hand, one has to be quite predictable and reliable when dealing with one's allies. It's a matter of gamesmanship and diplomacy is indeed a game and battle of wits, not something to blindly go blundering around in. ;)

Pandering? No. I have only stated a continuation of the current policy as per the NPA and boosting enlistments in the NPA; and in an ideal world, I know who I would want in my Cabinet but reality is another thing.

Go rogue? Never.

Different than the other 'legitimate' candidates? Most certainly.

If I read my Flemingovia correctly, he seems quite kerfluffled at the potential of 'status quo' which I presume he finds distasteful and boring. I tend to agree with his assessment concerning 'status quo' and maintaining status quo, and no, don't accuse me of pandering. I have a quite different view of 'status quo' than Flemingovia does. Of that I can assure you.

What I believe Flemingovia is hinting at is that we need change in a more 'radical' fashion. Change is fine and radical change is fine, only when conditions require it. Currently, radical change can cause any number of problems as radical changes tend to originate from the pure belief that change is automatically good and radical change is even better. Radical change often ends up quite pair-shaped more often than not as such plans usually involve following untested roads without any real consideration of the consequences.

For example, the whole concept of making "Flemingovianism" the 'official' state religion of TNP. Change? Yes. Radical? Yes. A fun idea? Probably. Well though out as per the potential consequences? No. Abhorrent to the belief that Church and State make a very poor cocktail? Definitely.

Change for the sake of change is unwise at best, and utter stupidity at worst. Radical change when not required or for light and transient reasons, even worse.

I prefer well-reasoned and measure for measure change with a good consideration for consequences and unintended consequences. Primarily, change should be for the purpose of efficiency and to adapt to new and future conditions, not just for the sake of change or to make things more interesting. Change for the sake of change alone is like jumping from an aircraft without properly packing one's parachute (which, of course could be interesting if not fatal and not for long).

Can I 'rock the boat' and make things interesting? Sure, no problem in that department if that's what is needed, but my first and only interest is in the well being of TNP, keeping things lively and interesting and, hopefully, entertaining and interesting.

While candidates always promise you to do great things and deliver all manner of promises just to get elected, I make no such claims.

What I can promise is that I will be different than other previous Delegates and that I will leave the region in a better state than when it was given to my care, and that it will be an interesting term of service. What exactly will I do? That depends upon what is thrown my way and in consultation with better minds than mine.

Good and proper change comes from all of us, not just whom we elect as Delegate. Will there be change in the region? Of course, but it will actually come from everyone, no just one person or that person's ego.
 
Have the elections even officially started with? :P

Shouldn't we wait until people are all officially running before we start choosing people to support? There are likely candidates who are waiting until it's official.
 
Rach:
Have the elections even officially started with? :P

Shouldn't we wait until people are all officially running before we start choosing people to support? There are likely candidates who are waiting until it's official.
What's that? A voice from the wilderness? Can't quite make out the message.. :P
 
Rach:
Have the elections even officially started with? :P

Shouldn't we wait until people are all officially running before we start choosing people to support? There are likely candidates who are waiting until it's official.
More fool them. In TNP it is the early bird that catches the worm.

Any candidate bovine enough to wait until the official start of campaigning probably does not have the gumption to deserve a vote.
 
flemingovia:
Any candidate bovine enough to wait until the official start of campaigning probably does not have the gumption to deserve a vote.
Must be lonely in the ivory tower, Rapunzel. :console: I don't see how cows are relevant..

Gumption? That's a bit Kentuckian don't you think? :P (not that there's anything wrong with that)
 
Democratic Donkeys:
Thank you for the commentary! It is refreshing to see such an interest in our elections, instead of the usual seeming plod towards a shoe-in candidate. We'll still be doing so come election time, but at least we are talking about it. :D

I agree it is quite interesting so far, a benefit of me being unable to run again, I think.... I admit I'm not sure who I will support or if I will even support any of them. I may abstain from voting. I wish you had the time to run, the campaign would be even more interesting!

flemingovia:
Rach:
Have the elections even officially started with? :P

Shouldn't we wait until people are all officially running before we start choosing people to support? There are likely candidates who are waiting until it's official.
More fool them. In TNP it is the early bird that catches the worm.

Any candidate bovine enough to wait until the official start of campaigning probably does not have the gumption to deserve a vote.

I agree, I think with the level of momentum some of these candidates have achieved it would be difficult for someone to really catch up on that at this point. Lennart's decision to pull out of the race should have an effect, he did have quite a significant amount of support and I will be interested to see if he decides to endorse a particular candidate for Delegate and ask his supporters to vote for them.

But we can't know for sure how this is going to go until nominations open and voting begins. I'm not prepared to call the election for anyone at this point.
 
Rach:
Have the elections even officially started with? :P

Shouldn't we wait until people are all officially running before we start choosing people to support? There are likely candidates who are waiting until it's official.
Blame me, please! I started my election process about a month early last time. I wanted to be goofy and change things up, and of course if one candidate is getting their name out early, then the other likely candidates are pretty much forced to compete. I also started the speculation thread for this election cycle about a month ago. :P

It is fun to break up the routine and add a little spice to the election. It is too bad that more people aren't replicating my frankly fantastic campaign threads. This one is still my favorite.
 
flemingovia:
Of the four, Mall stands out as distinctive. He is the Lutz candidate, standing on the platform of turning rogue, propped up by raider support and making the NPA a purely raider force. Current opinion in TNP is that Mall is unelectable on this current platform. A vote for Mall would be fun, but wasted. There is nothing much to add, apart from the worrying observation that the current deputy minister of defence, Gladio, has expressed “full support” for this platform. Hmmmm.

I think to count me out by banking on TNP's voters being rational is a dangerous assumption indeed. I won a cabinet position on a platform of inactivity and corruption awhile back remember.

I'll note that that my three opponents certainly do seem to be nothing much more than pale shadows of McMasterdonia, perhaps that is why they were invited to participate in a Delegate Candidate debate whereas I was excluded by McM.
 
There is a huge difference between winning an election for a cabinet position and winning one for in-game delegate.

I hate to burst the bubble of cabinet ministers, but in the grand scheme of things those positions do not matter much, and people will be more inclined to vote for the lutz or just to kick the beehive.
 
Mall for Delegate and McMasterdonia for Vice-Delegate!

Having perused the Constitution of the North Pacific, it may be worth our while to consider a ticket of Mall for Delegate and McMasterdonia for Vice Delegate. To wit:

Constitution of the North Pacific:
Article 2. The Regional Assembly

3. The Regional Assembly may remove a government official from office by a two-thirds majority vote.
The above clause is why we should elect Mall -- but we will have to be very expeditious in this matter. Speed is the crux of the success of the whole ticket.

Constitution of the North Pacific:
Article 3. The Delegate and Vice Delegate

11. If the Delegate is removed or unable to serve, the Vice Delegate will assume the duties of the Delegate [emphasis added]. If the Vice Delegate is also unable to serve, the first available person in the line of succession will assume the duties of the Delegate.
The above clause is what would permit McMasterdonia to assume the duties of the Delegate.

Constitution of the North Pacific:
Article 3. The Delegate and Vice Delegate

12. The Delegate and Vice Delegate will be elected by the Regional Assembly by a majority vote every four months. No person shall be elected Delegate to a full or partial term in three consecutive election cycles [emphasis added].
The above clause would not be violated because McMasterdonia would not have been elected Delegate in this election cycle. Nor is it a coup as constitutionally mandated procedures would be followed.

All of this presumes, of course, that the Regional Assembly could be trusted to remove Mall by a two-thirds majority vote in a timely manner. And with that, it is a good thing we have elections...

>^,,^<
Alunya
 
That's actually somewhat brilliant. Of course you could always just wait until I had purged and then let Mcmasterdonia pry the delegacy from my hands. From an entertainment perspective that'd be much better.
 
Alunya:
Mall for Delegate and McMasterdonia for Vice-Delegate!

Having perused the Constitution of the North Pacific, it may be worth our while to consider a ticket of Mall for Delegate and McMasterdonia for Vice Delegate. To wit:

Constitution of the North Pacific:
Article 2. The Regional Assembly

3. The Regional Assembly may remove a government official from office by a two-thirds majority vote.
The above clause is why we should elect Mall -- but we will have to be very expeditious in this matter. Speed is the crux of the success of the whole ticket.

Constitution of the North Pacific:
Article 3. The Delegate and Vice Delegate

11. If the Delegate is removed or unable to serve, the Vice Delegate will assume the duties of the Delegate [emphasis added]. If the Vice Delegate is also unable to serve, the first available person in the line of succession will assume the duties of the Delegate.
The above clause is what would permit McMasterdonia to assume the duties of the Delegate.

Constitution of the North Pacific:
Article 3. The Delegate and Vice Delegate

12. The Delegate and Vice Delegate will be elected by the Regional Assembly by a majority vote every four months. No person shall be elected Delegate to a full or partial term in three consecutive election cycles [emphasis added].
The above clause would not be violated because McMasterdonia would not have been elected Delegate in this election cycle. Nor is it a coup as constitutionally mandated procedures would be followed.

All of this presumes, of course, that the Regional Assembly could be trusted to remove Mall by a two-thirds majority vote in a timely manner. And with that, it is a good thing we have elections...

>^,,^<
Alunya
A brilliant, legal, but flawed solution. It's too risky.

How about this as an alternative:

Everyone knows McM wants another term as delegate.

Most people want this too. That is why three of the candidates are so keen to present themselves as McM-lite.

Everyone knows I would never, ever go rogue ... And I have been nominated as delegate.

If McM agrees, i will stand as delegate, with him as vice. If elected, I will immediately put myself up for recall....... And McM gets his extra term.

The system will have been followed legally, and we get what we want.

How about it, McM?
 
Flemingovia:

If McM agrees, i will stand as delegate, with him as vice. If elected, I will immediately put myself up for recall....... And McM gets his extra term.

Which means that you would be running for Delegate under false pretenses, which in turn would be gross misconduct at best, and directly an attempt to overthrow the intent of the term limitations clause (three consecutive terms being prohibited as the intent).

Such a course of action is no better than what rogues have done or attempted to do in the past: use the Constitution as a means to violate the Constitution in intent and spirit.

As such, an attempt to do something like this would also make a sham out of The North Pacific and tarnish the legitimacy of the government. It would be nothing short of a tortuous coup and would tend to royally piss off a lot of people in the process. It would damage the reputation of the region which claims to not want permanent rulers, kings or whatever in perpetuity.

Risky is not the word for it. I can think of other words for it but discretion being the better part of valor, I won't utter them.
 
Even if I was Vice Delegate and the Delegate resigned - that would trigger a special election. I would be ineligible to run in said election.
 
That is also true. It would also cause the line of succession to come into play until that election is completed. Talk about potential chaos.
 
mcmasterdonia:
Even if I was Vice Delegate and the Delegate resigned - that would trigger a special election. I would be ineligible to run in said election.
I disagree.

two clauses of our laws come into effect:

The constitution, Article 3

11. If the Delegate is removed or unable to serve, the Vice Delegate will assume the duties of the Delegate. If the Vice Delegate is also unable to serve, the first available person in the line of succession will assume the duties of the Delegate.

Please note, the constitution does not say "shall assume the duties of the delegate until a special election."

The legal code, Chapter 4:

Section 4.5: Special Elections
20. A special election will be held in the event of a vacancy in any elected office or position, unless the election would be unable to conclude prior to the beginning of the scheduled election cycle for that office.
21. The Delegate, or if the Delegate is not available, the Vice Delegate, or if the Delegate and Vice Delegate are not available, the Speaker, will serve as Election Commissioner for the special election.

On the plain reading of the next, these seem to be contradictory, until you realise that in the event of the removal of a delegate there is no vacancy in the office, the Vice Delegate steps up serves, as the Constitution says.

the line of succession comes into play if the VD will not, or cannot serve as delegate. Unless the Security council decides to unilaterally ignore Article 3:11 of the constitution.
 
Romanoffia:
Which means that you would be running for Delegate under false pretenses, which in turn would be gross misconduct at best, and directly an attempt to overthrow the intent of the term limitations clause (three consecutive terms being prohibited as the intent).

Such a course of action is no better than what rogues have done or attempted to do in the past: use the Constitution as a means to violate the Constitution in intent and spirit.
I am astonished to hear such words from the Chief Justice of the region, and can only assume that his own political ambitions for the power of the delegacy have clouded his legal judgement.

The courts have repeatedly refused to speculate on the intent of the framers of our laws, limiting their opinions to what our laws actually say. I suggest objections are framed continuing that spirit.

... false pretenses (sic) ... gross misconduct ... an attempt to overthrow ... rogues ... nothing short of a tortuous coup ... Risky....

As for the issue of this being somehow a "rogue" action, the Chief Justice is fortunate that he is protected by the lack of a civil court in TNP, because the language and tone of his post borders on slanderous.

Far from having false pretences, I am being utterly transparent in my motives and actions. I am not seeking power in TNP. What I am seeking to do in (let me remind you) a political simulation is to use the political process to achieve a desired political end.

This is the same as you are doing through the vehemence of your post, which is blatantly to prevent a course of action taking place that would prevent your ascendance to the throne.

I am always suspicious of someone who seems too hungry for power. My motives are utterly transparent. Are yours? Should we be worried?
 
I'd say it at least falls afoul of your oath to the RA though. "responsible action as a member of her society" specifically.

That said, I doubt I could get a conviction on such a count, but I think charges could certainly be supported.

And I think the idea is just far far too risky. If a "majority of the region" had truly wanted McM to run for another term they'd have changed the law in time. They didn't, so you know... let the system work the way it's supposed to, and allow some fresh blood in there.

There's a virtue to letting some of the newer members of government know that they won't have to wait years to get a shot at the delegacy.
 
Back
Top