I've been waiting a long time for this.

nikocujo

nikocujo

TNPer
I would say hello, but your current behavior does not warrant such niceties. As the Enforcer of the Gatesville High Council, my job is to make sure that you people get on the same page as the rest of the game. You holding out is really just a waste of everyone's time if you stop and think about it. So Gatesville is giving you an opportunity to join us, endorse the current delegate or suffer the consequences of defying. You have seen the Strategic might of the Guard,and we will turn them in an instance to attack your interests as soon as possible if you don't endorse Lewis and Clark and end this worthless underground "movement." You were the old guard, change is inevitable...deal with it. You have 4 days to move your endorsements to Lewis and Clark and end the endorsement of you "champion."
 
Nice to see you too.

Just so we are clear - is this four days from the time you posted, or four days from the time we read your post? This is important because over the EAster weekend there are a lot of people who will be away, and we would not want them to miss your deadline becuase of it. Please would you clarify.

While you are waiting, we have opened a special bar for Gatesville troopers which you will find further down the forum.

It is really lovely that you are here. :hello:


PS. you may wish to edit your post. I think you meant "instant" not "instance" and I think you meant "your" not "you" in the penultimate word. It is important in posts of historic importance to be accurate, isn't it?
 
Hello. I'm glad to see someone expressing Gatesville's interests in an articulate manner.

However, does your offer not contradict Gates' ultimatum to destroy us at all costs? In addition, if we are the pathetic resistance group that we are, why are you going out of your way to offer us positions in Gatesville.

Finally, we are TNPers. Wouldn't it make more sense to propagandize for WW's forum than for Gatesville, since we have a sense of loyalty to the region?
 
nikocujo:
I would say hello, but your current behavior does not warrant such niceties. As the Enforcer of the Gatesville High Council, my job is to make sure that you people get on the same page as the rest of the game. You holding out is really just a waste of everyone's time if you stop and think about it. So Gatesville is giving you an opportunity to join us, endorse the current delegate or suffer the consequences of defying. You have seen the Strategic might of the Guard,and we will turn them in an instance to attack your interests as soon as possible if you don't endorse Lewis and Clark and end this worthless underground "movement." You were the old guard, change is inevitable...deal with it. You have 4 days to move your endorsements to Lewis and Clark and end the endorsement of you "champion."
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Hi nikocujo! :hello: Welcome to the forum. Please let me know if you have any questions. As always, I'll be glad to help. :D

You should know I am most interested in having everyone on the same page. Perhaps it would be best if we started with the same book. :jack:

First off, in my book, folks are more amenable to change if there is a positive inducement. Threats and efforts to intimidate are less effective in bringing about long-term change. Insults may actually be counter-productive to your ends.

Second, as Enforcer what specifically can you do? You speak of our "suffering the consequences," but I am a little fuzzy on the details. You will... eject us? Double-eject us? Double-secret eject us? Say mean things about our mothers? Go beat up our friends? Please let us know. We are curious.

Finally, I have been here a very long time. I have yet to see the democratic spirit of the North Pacific swept away because of one man's say-so. Not as long as I'm here, dear. You can bluster all you want, but L&C can't touch me. We WILL have democracy in our region once again.
 
My apologies for incorrect grammar, I was in a rush.

But more importantly, you defying GV has really just been a thorn in our side that is why we want full cooperation. This of course means cooperating with us.

I see this is all a joke to many. And I'm sure the Monday after easter shall be enough for some to start changing allegiance. Really, I'm looking for intent and the start of cooperation not a finished product. Intent is important to me.

And believe me, as Enforcer, I have the power to determine if you were willing to play ball. You probably won't. However, I wanted to give you a sporting chance. The consequences will be the termination of the Old Guard's Interests. I'll leave you to start thinking about allies and their wellbeing.
 
Monday after Easter. Gotcha. Just one teeny follow up question.

Is that Easter according to the Western Church (March 23rd) or Easter according to the Eastern Church (April 27th)? We have folks from both traditions on these forums so I am a little fuzzy about which Easter you mean.

This has been a source of contention within the church since the First Council of Nicea in AD325, so I doubt if it will be cleared up in time to make your threat clear.

Might I suggest that linking a threat to a movable feast is a little silly? Since you seem to be having problems making a simple threat, can I suggest you fill in the form below that we keep for such eventualities?

As you can tell, we get a lot of threats.

I am glad to be of service:

NAME:

REGION REPRESENTED:

POSITION IN REGIONAL GOVERNMENT:

DOES YOUR THREAT COME WITH THE SUPPORT OF YOUR REGIONAL GOVERNMENT?    YES/NO

PRECISE DATE OF THREAT (Gregorian Calendar):

PRECISE TIME OF THREAT (G.M.T.)*:

PRECISE NATURE OF THREAT (Please continue on the reverse side of this forum if necessary):





*Do not correct for daylight saving
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Flem, you forgot to mention those of us who do not observe Easter at all, it which case the "deadline" is at perpetual infinity (and according to the Doctor Who episode "Utopia" is around 500 trillion years from now).

So nikocujo, you might as well get settled in. You've a long wait ahead of you.

>|P
 
Again, the "wit." The 24th. I was hasty and went ahead with the Roman Catholic observance of Easter. I stated 4 days, so your wit in the "long haul" doesn't really work Gross.
 
nikocujo, I understand how this can be maddeningly annoying.

I am, however, largely relieved at what I am seeing. TNPers are reading your threat and choosing to find amusement rather than exploding in anger, which would otherwise be the result.

I mean, how would you feel if someone came into your region and demanded that you obey others in your region, or be destroyed? I would wager that the first, nigh instinctive reaction is to think "How dare they!" and become angry, no?

My point is that sure your ultimatum is being laughed at, but isn't that better all around than it being taken as a mortal insult? Isn't it better to hear laughter than enraged flames? I think so.
 
Eluvatar:
nikocujo, I understand how this can be maddeningly annoying.

I am, however, largely relieved at what I am seeing. TNPers are reading your threat and choosing to find amusement rather than exploding in anger, which would otherwise be the result.

I mean, how would you feel if someone came into your region and demanded that you obey others in your region, or be destroyed? I would wager that the first, nigh instinctive reaction is to think "How dare they!" and become angry, no?

My point is that sure your ultimatum is being laughed at, but isn't that better all around than it being taken as a mortal insult? Isn't it better to hear laughter than enraged flames? I think so.
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See, Elu, the problem is that we are here to help the legal delegate. A few are under the impression that Lewis and Clark hacked the election without any evidence. We can provide the tally if you would like, but the evidence proves that L&C is the rightful delo. I would be upset if someone came into the region and stole the delegacy, but if GV were a region that held delo elections, I wouldn't form a resistance group because I was salty over the legal results.
 
See, this is the kind of thinking that you rogues and fascists are all falling prey to, and which will be your downfall as always.

You don't win an election, you are elected by the people. This is an expression of the people's trust in your ability and willingness to do your job as delegate. This job as delegate, as described in the oath of office, includes following the constitution and the laws of the North Pacific.

It is not to suspend the constitution, declare new laws, or to attempt to tear the community apart. These actions constitute treason to the North Pacific, and a traitor cannot be a legitimated delegate.

So your quibbling about whether Lewis and Clark "hacked" an election or was "rightfully" elected is irrelevant. Lewis and Clark, elected or not, has abused his office to commit treasonous and harmful acts against the North Pacific, forfeiting any legitimacy he might have had.

You may believe in different laws - laws that give the game's delegate dictatorial powers. We do not recognize these laws any more than you recognize our constitution. Under these circumstances, legitimacy is a moot point that can be decided only by the bayonets and endorsements of the game.

Bring it on.

---
(Sorry for taking it seriously and spoiling the fun mood. Shall we celebrate a countdown party while we wait for the ultimatum to end? I got firecrackers!)
 
Ermarian:
See, this is the kind of thinking that you rogues and fascists are all falling prey to, and which will be your downfall as always.

You don't win an election, you are elected by the people. This is an expression of the people's trust in your ability and willingness to do your job as delegate. This job as delegate, as described in the oath of office, includes following the constitution and the laws of the North Pacific.

It is not to suspend the constitution, declare new laws, or to attempt to tear the community apart. These actions constitute treason to the North Pacific, and a traitor cannot be a legitimated delegate.

So your quibbling about whether Lewis and Clark "hacked" an election or was "rightfully" elected is irrelevant. Lewis and Clark, elected or not, has abused his office to commit treasonous and harmful acts against the North Pacific, forfeiting any legitimacy he might have had.

You may believe in different laws - laws that give the game's delegate dictatorial powers. We do not recognize these laws any more than you recognize our constitution. Under these circumstances, legitimacy is a moot point that can be decided only by the bayonets and endorsements of the game.

Bring it on.

---
(Sorry for taking it seriously and spoiling the fun mood. Shall we celebrate a countdown party while we wait for the ultimatum to end? I got firecrackers!)
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Thus lies the inner problem! You all cry that GBM is the "rightful" delegate. You care about the term "rightful."

And the majority of TNP has gone along with L&C's changes. Cleaning house can be good, you know. I don't see the majority crying "treason." Do you?
 
Thus lies the inner problem! You all cry that GBM is the "rightful" delegate. You care about the term "rightful."

And the majority of TNP has gone along with L&C's changes. Cleaning house can be good, you know. I don't see the majority crying "treason." Do you?
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I do. Where did you look?

And do you want the honest truth? I speak for no one else with this. I care precisely one half of a rodent's posterior about the term "rightful" in this case. GBM, in a long line of delegates, is among the few whose policies have been sensible and whose loyalty to the constitution has been unquestioned. I trust GBM to put things right and then let the democratic process resume. That she was elected vice delegate before all hell broke lose is merely a practical argument by putting her endorsement count high enough to be a threat to L&C.
 
Ermarian: as a point of fact GBM was appointed Vice Delegate by Lewis and Clark.

nikocujo:
What majority has gone along with these changes? I do not see any dramatic difference in activity between that forum over this one.
 
Just for some fun with my old friend, the Enforcer.

Surely, sir Nikocujo, you are not saying that the majority can declare what is treason and what is not? Surely you aren't saying that an election to a post with clear powers and limitations does not mean election to an undefined post with limitless powers?

George W. Bush won the American Presidential election. He did not then have the right, moral, legal, sensible, etc. to declare the Bushian States of Walker's George. Not even if the majority of the people thought that "hey, this dude's cool, and what an awesome name!" It would reject all centuries of Anglo-American jurisprudence. Likewise, it does not matter if his new government was deemed better in some way (activity, etc.) than the previous.

Now, yes, this is a game. But you ruin the fun of this game if you have to resort to pointing out such an obvious fact to make your case. As such, plase do not. Argue, without fallacies, the actual substance here.

If you all want to know why I still am ambivalent on the regime change, and could easily support the Crimson Order, ask away. Might be a while before I respond, though... Send a PM, actually, if curious. *hopes nobody is*

*goes back into retirement*
 
Some retirement SD... you're like an addict.

All that I'm trying to point out is that L&C is the legal delegate. He cleaned house...So did I when I became FA of GV. I could honestly care less what he did to better the region, but what I do know is that he won the election. Some are pissy about it. If I were in their shoes, I wouldn't create an underground movement to "dethrone" the winner. Would I be salty? You betcha. Would I moan? A bit. Would I try to sabotage the legal transfer of power? No.
 
Would I try to sabotage the legal transfer of power? No.
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Nor did anyone here. It was only when Westwind went beyond the law, went rogue (as Nevadar so rightly put it) that the opposition began.
 
Ad hominem in the very first sentence? And between us? :(

When you were Foreign Affairs Advocate of Gatesville ... you suspended the Charter and threw Gates and Nevadar out the window ... ? The would be the logical comparison, dear friend.

Lewis and Clark won an election to fulfill a very specific job. He was hired by the electorate to do something. He terminated his own contract, thus abrogating any legal right of his to even carry out the normal powers of said contract, let alone the massive ones he has so graciously given himself.

Why would you be salty and why would you moan if you found the transfer of power and the abolition of the constitution (thus the violation of Lewis and Clark's original contract) to be entirely legal? I don't think you would ... I don't have you down as whiner ...

Edit: to Nikocujo, obviously
 
But if a majority of the electorate is still supporting Westwind in his new government then it becomes different. Whether, that is correct I would not know. As a guess, I would say it's roughly even although muddied by the number of foreign interveners on both side.
 
As far as legal goes, Emperor Matthuis, I'd beg to differ. That he commands a majority of North Pacificans in support of the Crimson Order does not refute the fact that he violated his contract.

If, indeed, his majority was clearly foreseen, then going about things within the context of his contract would have been advisable.
 
nikocujo:
Some retirement SD... you're like an addict.

All that I'm trying to point out is that L&C is the legal delegate. He cleaned house...So did I when I became FA of GV. I could honestly care less what he did to better the region, but what I do know is that he won the election. Some are pissy about it. If I were in their shoes, I wouldn't create an underground movement to "dethrone" the winner. Would I be salty? You betcha. Would I moan? A bit. Would I try to sabotage the legal transfer of power? No.
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Ohfer--- are you reading anything in this thread? Again with shorter words:

L&C win vote for leader, fair and square*. Leader must follow laws on piece of paper called "Constitution". Leader cannot rip paper to shreds; leader cannot change forum without more vote. L&C rip paper to shreds, no more vote, new forum. L&C not leader anymore, he traitor.

(*L&C sneaky. He plan rip paper to shreds long before he win vote.)
 
Well, Folks, it is Easter Sunday. 24 hours to our doom at the hands of Gatesville. I just want you to know, in our last day together, that it has been a privilege and a pleasure knowing you all. Tomorrow, when our doom falls, I know we shall meet our fate bravely.

Until then, I have provided a handy checklist to help you get the most out of our last day before the might of Gatesville falls upon us. Please be sure to...

1. Kiss your children goodbye,
2. Make a will.
3. Eat a nice meal containing all your favourite foodstuffs.
4. Have sex with your partner of choice.*
5. Put on your nicest clothes and...

...tomorrow...

6. Switch on your computer and meet your fate.



*BOTH your choices, obviously.
 
But I don't want to die again! I like living again much better :( :ermm:

Also it isn't easter yet, so I can't eat it :(

Could this impending doom be any less convenient? At least I don't have much to divide in my will, some time saved. :ermm:

:bunny:
 
Thanks for the update you sent on over to NSPE. As I am unable to get onto the other TNP forum, Ill post this hear.

if anyone is interested in an interview, contact me.
 
Outer Kharkistania:
The Majority?

He is up by 50 endorsements. 30 are Gatesville. I suspect the other 20 are E-Army.

I rest my case.
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Maybe I'm intruding here, but I'm sure it's possible that many of L&C's endorsements are from people ignorant of the whole situation, and see he's the delegate and just endorse him for the sake of endorsing him.

According to the game rules, this may constitute democracy and enough to elect a delegate, but when many of the voters are in actuality unaware of other candidates and the wider picture, then surely this can not be considered democracy.

Maybe I am wrong though.

MDH
 
Well, I'm sure that's part of it too. GBM has some foreign volunteers, too, although none are being sent in by a power as large and as organized as Gatesville- rather, most are individuals here on their own time. The unknowing natives most likely are what off set those people.
 
Emperor Matthuis:
But if a majority of the electorate is still supporting Westwind in his new government then it becomes different. Whether, that is correct I would not know. As a guess, I would say it's roughly even although muddied by the number of foreign interveners on both side.
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2 questions:

1. How long does one need to be in The TNP to no longer be considered foreign? Is there any guideline for that?

2. Why is Gatesville coming here and making threats towards the GBM regime? Why not Westwind himself? After all, he did go rogue right?
 
The consequences will be the termination of the Old Guard's Interests.
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Four hours to go.

So that Gatesville are clear, my interests include tea drinking, wine, playing Nightfall, cooking (especially Indian Food) and gangster movies.

Can I suggest that others post their interests here so that Gatesville will find it easer to terminate them?
 
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