Confirmation of Eluvatar as Election Commissioner

[St George]

Mr. Speaker @St George I am nominating @Eluvatar to the Election Commission.

The delegate has nominated @Eluvatar as Election Commissioner. I now open the floor for debate and discussion on the nomination. I would welcome a statement in support of the nomination from @Prydania.

 

[Robespierre]

I take up no issues with the nominee.

Elu has past experience serving on the Election Commission and I concur with the Delegate in believing that they’d be a fine addition to the team.

 

[Prydania]

We had an opening for the electoral commission and Elu's record of service speaks for itself. I think someone of Elu's status would be ideal given the sudden resignation of Wonderess.

 

[St George]

We had an opening for the electoral commission and Elu's record of service speaks for itself. I think someone of Elu's status would be ideal given the sudden resignation of Wonderess.

Could you elaborate on Elu's record of service for those who might not be familiar with him?

 

[Oracle]

I motion for a vote

 

[Eluvatar]

Could you elaborate on Elu's record of service for those who might not be familiar with him?

May I?

 

[Comfed]

I second the motion for a vote... I think it works that way.

 

[Prydania]

Mr. Speaker, I would like to encourage @Eluvatar to follow up on his offer and go over his record of service to the region. It's very vast, and he could do a far better job of summing it up than I could XD

 

[St George]

May I?

Mr. Speaker, I would like to encourage @Eluvatar to follow up on his offer and go over his record of service to the region. It's very vast, and he could do a far better job of summing it up than I could XD

Of course.

 

[St George]

I motion for a vote

I second the motion for a vote... I think it works that way.

There is no rush for this appointment to go through and we are someway off the next election. I will deviate in this instance from the Standing Procedures and not schedule a vote at this time.

 

[Zyvetskistaahn]

There is no rush for this appointment to go through and we are someway off the next election. I will deviate in this instance from the Standing Procedures and not schedule a vote at this time.

Hear, hear!

What does the nominee think of the proposed rule change currently being considered by the Commission?

 

[Mall]

Will the nominee comment on the fact that they once illegally banned me from the region? Just over 8 years ago...

 

[Oracle]

This is highly irregular for the speaker to completely disregard two citizens motions for a vote.
I motion for an immediate vote.

 

[St George]

This is highly irregular for the speaker to completely disregard two citizens motions for a vote.
I motion for an immediate vote.

Motioning for a vote barely 12 hours after a proposal is posted is what is highly irregular. Why you in particular seek to rush through every government appointment with no oversight and barely any questioning of the appointee continues to strike me as bizarre.

As it is, there is no mechanism to force an immediate vote on this appointment and so one will not be allowed.

 

[Dreadton]

I move for an immediate vote.

 

[St George]

I move for an immediate vote.

As previously noted, there is no mechanism to force an immediate vote on this appointment.

But for the sake of argument, let's assume that the mechanism as noted in the Regional Assembly rules applies. This mechanism is laid out thusly:

4. If a number of citizens equal to or exceeding one third of the number of votes required to achieve quorum for any legislative vote, including the citizen that introduced the proposal to the Regional Assembly, motion that a vote should be held on a proposal before the Regional Assembly, then the Speaker must schedule a vote on that proposal to begin as soon as permitted by law.

As the citizen who introduced the proposal to the Regional Assembly, I will not be joining any motion for an immediate vote.

But again I must ask, why the rush? Why is there a need for an immediate vote or even a scheduled vote when the appointee has questions to answers and has themselves asked to state their record for the region?

 

[Dreadton]

Because there is nothing new to discuss from the last two times Eluvatar has been appointed to the EC. Or from his elections to any number of other post within the regional government.

https://forum.thenorthpacific.org/topic/9189618/

Election Commission Confirmation of Eluvatar, Owenstacey, and Brendog

I hereby appoint @Eluvatar, @Owenstacey, and @Brendog as Election Commissioners, subject to a confirmation vote by the Regional Assembly. The Delegate has appointed @Eluvatar, @Owenstacey and @Brendog as Election Commissioners. Debate is now open for these nominees.

forum.thenorthpacific.org

 

[St George]

Because there is nothing new to discuss from the last two times Eluvatar has been appointed to the EC. Or from his elections to any number of other post within the regional government.

https://forum.thenorthpacific.org/topic/9189618/

Election Commission Confirmation of Eluvatar, Owenstacey, and Brendog

I hereby appoint @Eluvatar, @Owenstacey, and @Brendog as Election Commissioners, subject to a confirmation vote by the Regional Assembly. The Delegate has appointed @Eluvatar, @Owenstacey and @Brendog as Election Commissioners. Debate is now open for these nominees.

forum.thenorthpacific.org

At least one question has been asked of the appointee.

 

[Dreadton]

At least one question has been asked of the appointee.

Yes, the question mall tends to bring out when he feels he can score points. A question that has been discussed before. Nothing new to the conversation. And why this time and not any of the other two appointments?

 

[St George]

Yes, the question mall tends to bring out when he feels he can score points. A question that has been discussed before. Nothing new to the conversation. And why this time and not any of the other two appointments?

Zvyet asked a question above that post.

 

[Dreadton]

Zvyet asked a question above that post.

my apologies on that point. I missed his post.

 

[St George]

All good.

 

[Eluvatar]

I first became involved in The North Pacific in mid-2006 because it had gotten into a war with my then-region The Lexicon. One of the first things I did was to put the Constitution into LaTeX to marvel at its verbosity and intricacy. After The Lexicon had collapsed, I taught a class on the history of TNP's constitution in 2007. During this time, I was pretty two-faced: one face was Eluvatar, the Lexiconian-become-Taijituan with a fascination with TNP and its laws; the other face, Zemnaya Svoboda, a nation that loved to endorsement trade and spread around influence. Zemnaya Svoboda also briefly joined the then-elected Security Council - the better to apply their interest in regional endorsement practices - and served as Vice Delegate. Also, Eluvatar was elected Speaker.

In late 2007, after a couple of peaceful or brief coups (Chodean Kal / Emperor Matthuis) the region voted to replace the old constitution with Monte Ozarka's, repealing most of the laws at the same time. Both Eluvatar and Zemnaya Svoboda were inactive at this time. The first Delegate elected under this new system, Lewis and Clark (also known as Westwind), proclaimed a Crimson Order after some minor conflicts, beginning another coup. This one lasted from February to April of 2008. In March, I got involved again. Getting the low-down from Limitless Events I figured I wanted to support the side that valued democracy and was willing to reform over the side that was proclaiming a monarchic order and staying in power using the Gatesville Guard. I reached out to Flemingovia and Great Bights Mum, and told them I was both Eluvatar and Zemnaya Svoboda. I coordinated action, using Zemnaya Svoboda's accumulated influence to not be ejected. In the end, the inactivity of the Crimson Order and efforts by myself as ZS and others to encourage the region to unendorse him and endorse Great Bights Mum (and/or ZS) led to Gatesville needing to deploy more and more forces, and ultimately to a peace deal between TNP's community and Gatesville. Once they withdrew, Lewis and Clark saw the writing on the wall and, ejectiong one last nation, left. After that, I came clean on this forum, relating that I was both Eluvatar and Zemnaya Svoboda, explaining myself a bit, and promising not to multi with ZS in the future

Right after this, with Great Bights Mum's support, I was elected Delegate for the first time. As TNP WA Delegate I tried to bring people together (including former Crimson Order supporters) and made my priority to make TNP a player, not a playing field, in NSGP. I like to think I succeeded: TNP ended up going to war with Gatesville because we didn't kowtow to their demands to support The Empire in that coup of The East Pacific, and even went on the offensive. I also worked with Tresville and others to Propose an influence-based Security Council which, with some help from Ivan, we now have.

After some absences and sporadic activity, I came back in 2011 to serve as Attorney General (and attempt to prosecute JAL for his coup) and join the Security Council (and resist Blue Wolf's coupy intentions). As a forum admin, I also reorganized the categories and subfora to be more streamlined. I also created the Progressive Party with an agenda of effective reforms in the region. In May 2012, I was elected Delegate and Gulliver as Speaker. Working together, we pretty much achieved that agenda through the most active government in years and replacement of the legal code and constitution with more organized and cohesive versions. In that period, as Delegate, I held elections for my cabinet (termed Executive Council or Council of Five) using the Single Transferable Vote.

My 2012 Delegacy ended with a period of inactivity by myself and recall from office. I afterward helped McMasterdonia continue to hold elections for Executive Council, until the troll vote getting Govindia in ended the practice. I continued to serve for a time in the Security Council.

In 2014-2015 I got involved at higher levels again, serving as Minister of Defense and as Delegate for a partial term. As Defense Minister I helped free Lazarus from the NLO (aka the NPO) in early 2015. I was unfortunately also involved in the incident that led to Delegate Tomb being found guilty of Gross Misconduct for attempting to force Flemingovia to limit his speech as a condition of joining the NPA. During my Delegacy I found myself forced to end our alliance with Balder after they dissolved their government, and this led to strains in our alliance with Europeia.

I served as Election Commissioner on many occasions, and after a significant contretemps around specific wording and protocol, I drafted the election templates as a resource for future elections, and have made changes from time to time in consultation with other Commissioners. I have served as Election Commissioner both before and after the reform to have a standing Election Commission. As Election Commissioner, I always check that every ballot is counted properly, and sometimes find discrepancies which need correction.

I've also served on the Court on several occasions, and as Chief Justice at least once. I can expand on that if desired.

What does the nominee think of the proposed rule change currently being considered by the Commission?

I am generally inclined to favor counting the votes people meant to cast. I can see why some behavior in the voting thread should not be approved, much as how current RA voting rules were forced by Grosseschnauzer voting in purple. Striking a balance is essential.

I think that there is a superior change to the rules that we haven't drafted yet which I would rather support. I imagine it would be a clause of the rules that addresses this issue more broadly, not only regarding RON.

Will the nominee comment on the fact that they once illegally banned me from the region? Just over 8 years ago...

It was legal and you deserved it.

 

[Oracle]

I move for a vote.

 

[Mall]

It was legal and you deserved it.

The Court found that the power you exercised was unconstitutional. Silly turtle.

 

[St George]

I move for a vote.

Should this receive a second soon, I will schedule a vote to begin on either Monday or Tuesday, depending on activity in this topic over the weekend.

 

[Cretox]

I second the motion for a vote.

 

[Janus]

Monte Ozarka. That's the name that I've been trying to remember.

 

[Pallaith]

I’m all for people having a chance to consider and ask questions, but these EC confirmations happen all the time and many times it’s the same people coming up for vote. In the absence of new developments in the nominee’s performance or public service, this feels like a pantomime. It’s Elu.

While we’re scheduling a vote we can still be asking questions and having them answered. I don’t see why this particular confirmation requires shade to be cast at people who think this one doesn’t have to be dragged out for no reason.

 

[St George]

There's a difference between dragging out an appointment and actually giving people time to ask questions of an appointee. Ramming through government appointments barely 12 hours after discussion has started risks turning the Regional Assembly into nothing more than a rubber stamp - and that leads to the likes of Wonderess and Crown Islands being given seats on the Election Commission and then turning around and proving they shouldn't have been.

 

[Cosmosplosion]

There's a difference between dragging out an appointment and actually giving people time to ask questions of an appointee. Ramming through government appointments barely 12 hours after discussion has started risks turning the Regional Assembly into nothing more than a rubber stamp - and that leads to the likes of Wonderess and Crown Islands being given seats on the Election Commission and then turning around and proving they shouldn't have been.

Seconded. This stance is one I can certainly agree with.

 

[Pallaith]

Again, this is Elu. The other two had a lot of problems and background that would make this questioning period very important. I believe that situations are different even if on a basic level the process is the same for everyone. I wouldn’t encourage speeding up every single confirmation, this is just one of the easy calls.

I’m not sure TNP is capable of indulging rubber stamps anyway, when the controversy is potent and surrounding an individual, the RA will feast, and that’s when guarding against rubber stamping is most important. For what it’s worth, I have no problem waiting out the period you outlined before the vote. I was making an argument more in principle than opposing the time schedule you outlined Mr. Speaker.

 

[Cosmosplosion]

Rushing things when the target is someone who has been thoroughly vetted before doesn't particularly sound problematic by itself. The issue arises with operating in such a way that it becomes habit.

 

[Comfed]

The only “debate” I see here is the speaker arguing with the citizens.

 

[St George]

The only “debate” I see here is the speaker arguing with the citizens.

Yes well one often finds themselves only seeing the things they want to see.

@Pallaith Fair enough. If discussion doesn't pick up this one will likely go to vote on the AM of Monday morning.

 

[Praetor]

I'm a bit surprised that the Speakers' Office is so concerned about the motion to vote happening so quickly yet they weren't for the confirmation of Dreadton as prosecutor against Pigeon.

 

[St George]

I'm a bit surprised that the Speakers' Office is so concerned about the motion to vote happening so quickly yet they weren't for the confirmation of Dreadton as prosecutor against Pigeon.

Two different situations - one of which we considered more time-sensitive than this. Were this confirmation happening say... in the last week of August, we'd likely be moving quicker.

 

[Praetor]

Seems like a rather flimsy justification to attempt to separate the two cases. Court cases are not so time-sensitive that the prosecutor's vote needed to be opened within a couple of hours of the proposal being posted.

 

[Eluvatar]

Are there any more questions for yours truly?

 

[St George]

This is now at vote