[Complete]AT VOTE: Condemn The United Defenders League [Complete]

Belschaft:
I'd also like to note that TSP, a region that Joshua mentions twice as a victim of the UDL, is voting overwhelmingly against the resolution.
And that proves TSP loves the UDL? I do not think so. It just means they are not fans of approving the proposal.
 
Cormac Stark:
Joshua:
Posted in the SC forum for this condemnation by Elu using Zemnaya. A UDL member using his position in TNP to help influence people to vote against the UDL condemnation. Interesting.
Accusing Eluvatar of putting the UDL ahead of TNP given his history in this region -- not to mention the fact that he is carrying out the ministry delegated to him by Mcmasterdonia and the rest of the Executive Council, many of whom are not UDL members -- was an incredibly desperate and stupid move on your part.

Hopefully in light of this TNP citizens will now see this proposal for what it is: a petty attempt to carry out a personal grudge that looks a lot like a NationStates version of the Salem witch hunts. Disagree with Joshua? UDL puppet!

Not stupid or desperate Cormac. Simply because you feel it is untrue or invalid, does not make it actually untrue.

I have no personal grudge Cormac nor is this about pettiness. You all keep making that assertion but is simply not true. :)
 
Why can't reasonable people disagree on the merits of this resolution and vote accordingly without all of this name-calling?
 
Joshua:
Belschaft:
I'd also like to note that TSP, a region that Joshua mentions twice as a victim of the UDL, is voting overwhelmingly against the resolution.
And that proves TSP loves the UDL? I do not think so. It just means they are not fans of approving the proposal.
What it means is that we consider your proposal to be a sack load of shit and lies, especially the sections in relation to us.
 
Belschaft:
Joshua:
Belschaft:
I'd also like to note that TSP, a region that Joshua mentions twice as a victim of the UDL, is voting overwhelmingly against the resolution.
And that proves TSP loves the UDL? I do not think so. It just means they are not fans of approving the proposal.
What it means is that we consider your proposal to be a sack load of shit and lies, especially the sections in relation to us.
There ya go bel. And it certainly does not mean that. Every time proof was given you all label it as BS and lies. Simply because the UDL and their friends say so? I do not think so. Keep on calling it BS and lies but that does not necessarily make it so.
 
Joshua:
Belschaft:
Joshua:
Belschaft:
I'd also like to note that TSP, a region that Joshua mentions twice as a victim of the UDL, is voting overwhelmingly against the resolution.
And that proves TSP loves the UDL? I do not think so. It just means they are not fans of approving the proposal.
What it means is that we consider your proposal to be a sack load of shit and lies, especially the sections in relation to us.
There ya go bel. And it certainly does not mean that. Every time proof was given you all label it as BS and lies. Simply because the UDL and their friends say so? I do not think so. Keep on calling it BS and lies but that does not necessarily make it so.
I'm sorry, then what does our unanimous opposition to your resolution, specifically the section in relation to us, mean then? If it doesn't mean what we say it means.
 
It does not mean they all think it is lies and rubbish, but I do not speak for TSP. Do you? How can you presume they all think it lies and BS? Because you all told them it was? Just curious Bel.
 
Honestly, who cares what TSP Does in this case? This is TNP, we'll make our own decision - TSP can do what it likes.
 
Biyah:
Honestly, who cares what TSP Does in this case? This is TNP, we'll make our own decision - TSP can do what it likes.
Yeah, because TSP voting sternly against this resolution doesn't greatly undermine it. <_<
 
I think if the folks in TSP vote against it, it's likely they don't like something about this resolution. Either they disagree with the facts Josh is presenting or they don't like how Josh presents the facts.

If anyone here is also from TSP, can you give us any insight on the claims Josh made about the UDL? Was TSP perturbed by any actions taken by the UDL in the warzone? I'm reconsidering my vote because I actually do consider what the residents of TSP think in reference to this resolution has some merit. I'd prefer a member of the UDL who is also a member of TSP not reply to this if possible.

danke!
 
punk d:
I think if the folks in TSP vote against it, it's likely they don't like something about this resolution. Either they disagree with the facts Josh is presenting or they don't like how Josh presents the facts.

If anyone here is also from TSP, can you give us any insight on the claims Josh made about the UDL? Was TSP perturbed by any actions taken by the UDL in the warzone? I'm reconsidering my vote because I actually do consider what the residents of TSP think in reference to this resolution has some merit. I'd prefer a member of the UDL who is also a member of TSP not reply to this if possible.

danke!
I'll respond in detail after I get some sleep.
 
Belschaft:
I'd also like to note that TSP, a region that Joshua mentions twice as a victim of the UDL, is voting overwhelmingly against the resolution.
So? This isn't TSP.
Also, In the interests of disclosure, I have edited my voting post accordingly.
 
Jamie:
So? This isn't TSP.
*rubs his head*

This argument again, really? A condemnation is posed for X doing Y to A; but when A votes against the condemnation, people still just want to ignore this fact or diminish it.
 
Joshua:
It does not mean they all think it is lies and rubbish, but I do not speak for TSP. Do you? How can you presume they all think it lies and BS? Because you all told them it was? Just curious Bel.
Ironically Bel is Speaker of TSP.
 
Chasmanthe:
Joshua:
It does not mean they all think it is lies and rubbish, but I do not speak for TSP. Do you? How can you presume they all think it lies and BS? Because you all told them it was? Just curious Bel.
Ironically Bel is Speaker of TSP.
Indeed. I think I have a rather good understanding of why my comrades in TSP are opposing this resolution. Hileville's post -

AGAINST. I don't like the way we are portrayed in the resolution nor do I care for the wording in general also I believe most of this is actually geared more towards Uni than the UDL as a whole. whole.

- provides an apt summary of the general regional opinion, as I have gathered from both the forums and our IRC.
 
Present.

Voted abstain in Osiris, voted Present in The East Pacific.

My WA nation has abstained from voting.
 
Hileville:
punk d:
I think if the folks in TSP vote against it, it's likely they don't like something about this resolution. Either they disagree with the facts Josh is presenting or they don't like how Josh presents the facts.

If anyone here is also from TSP, can you give us any insight on the claims Josh made about the UDL? Was TSP perturbed by any actions taken by the UDL in the warzone? I'm reconsidering my vote because I actually do consider what the residents of TSP think in reference to this resolution has some merit. I'd prefer a member of the UDL who is also a member of TSP not reply to this if possible.

danke!
I'll respond in detail after I get some sleep.
Thanks, Hileville. Much appreciated.
 
unibot:
Jamie:
So? This isn't TSP.
*rubs his head*

This argument again, really? A condemnation is posed for X doing Y to A; but when A votes against the condemnation, people still just want to ignore this fact or diminish it.
Sorry - not following the crowd is ignoring/diminishing something? Why would we allow another GCR to determine our course?

Interesting.
 
unibot:
Jamie:
So? This isn't TSP.
*rubs his head*

This argument again, really? A condemnation is posed for X doing Y to A; but when A votes against the condemnation, people still just want to ignore this fact or diminish it.
They vote their way. TNP will vote ours. Just because they are opposed to the resolution doesn't mean we have to vote their way.
 
I want to be clear about my earlier comment. IF TSP doesn't vote for this condemnation doesn't mean we should. I just want to hear what they have to say because if the facts presented by Josh are different thant what the TSP people see, it will influence my vote.

When I was condemned, I don't recall one TWP'er in favor of my condemnation on the merits of it at all. I wanted it, but not because i agreed with the facts.*chuckles*.

That TWP, didn't favor it didn't stop the rest of the NS world from supporting the condemnation. So, I hope no one argues that if TSP is against this everyone else should be too...That doesn't line up with prior condemnations.

I'm just saying for me, depending on what Hileville or anyone else from TSP says about the actual claims in the resolution, my vote could be influenced.
 
Bel posted a copy of my post in TSP and I will elaborate a bit for you PD but it won't be until this evening as I had something unexpected come up.
 
The WA Affairs Ministry recognized 18 votes in favor, 14 votes opposed, 4 votes to abstain, and 3 present. As neither 14/36 nor 18/36 is a majority, the Ministry continues to advise the Delegate to abstain from voting at this time.

Iro:
I vote for. I declare that I have voted in Atrigeas as well.
On behalf of Delegate McMasterdonia: Iro, you are going to be warned for failure to abide by the WA voting policy by voting in Nysa without declaring it. As this is your first strike, your vote will be counted. On a second strike your vote will not be counted, in accordance with the policy.

Voter[c]TNP Nation[c]Vote[c]Other Regions[c]Cormac Stark[c]Cormac Stark[c]Against[c][c]Joshua[c]The Dead Angels[c]For[c][c]Sovreignry[c]Sovreignry North Pacific[c]Against[c]Osiris[c]Blue Wolf II[c]Blue Wolf II[c]For[c][c]Mall[c]Mall[c]For[c]Osiris[c]madjack[c]United Alesia[c]Against[c]Balder, Europeia, the South pacific[c]Venico[c]Numpkys[c]For[c]Osiris[c]Jamie[c]Jamie Anumia[c]For[c]Balder[c]flemingovia[c]Northern Flemingovia[c]Against[c][c]Lennart[c]Ehlnar[c]Abstain[c][c]Funkadelia[c]Funkadelia Island[c]For[c]Taijitu[c]Belschaft[c]North Pacific Belschaft[c]Against[c]the South Pacific, Osiris[c]Ravania[c]Ravania Aquilonia[c]Against[c]Osiris[c]Johz[c]That Johz Thing[c]Against[c][c]Iro[c]Checkers[c]For[c]Atrigeas[c]Earth[c]Earth22 IV[c]Against[c]Osiris, The Rejected Realms[c]Tim[c]Tim[c]Against[c]Osiris, Balder, Mordor, Equilism[c]Bryan von Richthofen[c]Maybe I Should Join[c]For[c][c]Biyah[c]Lord Rahl Reloaded[c]For[c]Osiris, The Rejected Realms[c]Gaspo[c]Gasponia[c]For[c][c]Kiwi[c]KiwiTaicho[c]Abstain[c][c]Windy[c]Windsor DC[c]Against[c]British Isles, Europeia, Democratium[c]DRUK[c]United Koryo[c]For[c]Osiris[c]King Durk the Awesome[c]Balkanlands[c]For[c][c]Empire of Narnia[c]Empire of Narnia[c]For[c][c]Kingborough[c]Kingborough II[c]Against[c]Nysa, Balder, British Isles, Lazarus[c]unibot[c]Unibot III[c]Abstain[c][c]punk d[c]MadhouseMike[c]For[c]The West Pacific[c]Mahaj[c]Sexy Cars[c]Against[c]Osiris[c]Lord Byron[c]God n Country n Byron[c]For[c][c]Former English Colony[c]Former English Colony[c]For[c][c]Alvino Castillon[c]Almaniania[c]Abstain[c][c]Grosseschnauzer[c]Grosseschnauzer[c]Against[c][c]Malvad[c]Malvad[c]Against[c][c]Thomas Insaniac[c]Eastern Hungry[c]For[c]British Isles[c]Scandigrad[c]Scandigrad[c]present[c][c]Pasargad[c]Pasargad[c]present[c][c]New Kervoskia[c]New Kervoskia[c]For[c]Osiris[c]Zaolat[c]Zaolat III[c]present[c]Osiris, The East Pacific
 
Eluvatar, Iro and no other Nysan member has voted on the matter so I request you withdraw your warning - I know for a fact you can't see our WA forums in Nysa so I don't know where you get this information.

Indeed you haven't even done this by checking our citizenship list and then issuing a general warning to people on it, because you've totally forgotten at least two other people who are members of Nysa. It appears you just have targeted Iro because he has in his signature that he holds office in Nysa.

I included the Nysa in my declaration in case I voted there, but we have not progressed to a vote at this stage so your warning is invalid.

Kingborough,
Founder of Nysa and President of the Nysan Organisation
 
Kingborough:
Eluvatar, Iro and no other Nysan member has voted on the matter so I request you withdraw your warning - I know for a fact you can't see our WA forums in Nysa so I don't know where you get this information.

Indeed you haven't even done this by checking our citizenship list and then issuing a general warning to people on it, because you've totally forgotten at least two other people who are members of Nysa. It appears you just have targeted Iro because he has in his signature that he holds office in Nysa.

I included the Nysa in my declaration in case I voted there, but we have not progressed to a vote at this stage so your warning is invalid.

Kingborough,
Founder of Nysa and President of the Nysan Organisation
I disagree with you, and support the Minister's actions.
 
Eluvatar:
The WA Affairs Ministry recognizes 14 in favor (Joshua, Blue Wolf II, Mall, Venico, Funkadelia, Iro, Bryan von Richthofen, Biyah, Gaspo, Windy, DRUK, King Durk the Awesome, Empire of Narnia, Punk D), 11 against (Cormac Stark, Sovreignry, madjack, flemingovia, Belschaft, Ravania, Johz, Earth, Tim, Kingborough, Mahaj), 4 for abstention (Jamie, Lennart, Kiwi, unibot), and 0 present.

As neither voting in favor nor voting against have a majority, the Ministry would advise the Delegate to abstain from voting at this time.
Windy:
Aye

will be voting in 2 other regions
On behalf of Delegate McMasterdonia: Windy, you are going to be warned for failure to abide by the WA voting policy. As this is your first strike, your vote will be counted. On a second strike your vote will not be counted, in accordance with the policy.
unibot:
Seems like it's kind of become a bit of partisan here :P If anyone does want to ask a question regarding this resolution, as the Head of UDL, I am more than capable of answering any questions people may have.

I find this resolution to be wholly inaccurate and incorrect, naturally.

I will abstain from the vote, only to avoid a conflict of interests, obviously I am against it in spirit. I have not voted anywhere else on this issue.
The Ministry is uncertain as to whether you intended to not affect the result of this vote and vote present, or whether you wished to vote for our Delegate to abstain. For now your vote is being counted as for abstention.
I don't get it. We're not allowed to vote elsewhere?
 
Govindia:
I don't get it. We're not allowed to vote elsewhere?

The policy is that you must disclose where else you have voted. Merely saying "I have voted in 2 other regions" does not count.

The WA Affairs Ministry recognizes 19 in favor, 14 against, 4 to abstain, and 3 present. As 19 is a majority of 37, the Ministry would advise the Delegate to vote for the resolution at this time.

Voter[c]TNP Nation[c]Vote[c]Other Regions[c]Cormac Stark[c]Cormac Stark[c]Against[c][c]Joshua[c]The Dead Angels[c]For[c][c]Sovreignry[c]Sovreignry North Pacific[c]Against[c]Osiris[c]Blue Wolf II[c]Blue Wolf II[c]For[c][c]Mall[c]Mall[c]For[c]Osiris[c]madjack[c]United Alesia[c]Against[c]Balder, Europeia, the South pacific[c]Venico[c]Numpkys[c]For[c]Osiris[c]Jamie[c]Jamie Anumia[c]For[c]Balder[c]flemingovia[c]Northern Flemingovia[c]Against[c][c]Lennart[c]Ehlnar[c]Abstain[c][c]Funkadelia[c]Funkadelia Island[c]For[c]Taijitu[c]Belschaft[c]North Pacific Belschaft[c]Against[c]the South Pacific, Osiris[c]Ravania[c]Ravania Aquilonia[c]Against[c]Osiris[c]Johz[c]That Johz Thing[c]Against[c][c]Iro[c]Checkers[c]For[c]Atrigeas[c]Earth[c]Earth22 IV[c]Against[c]Osiris, The Rejected Realms[c]Tim[c]Tim[c]Against[c]Osiris, Balder, Mordor, Equilism[c]Bryan von Richthofen[c]Maybe I Should Join[c]For[c][c]Biyah[c]Lord Rahl Reloaded[c]For[c]Osiris, The Rejected Realms[c]Gaspo[c]Gasponia[c]For[c][c]Kiwi[c]KiwiTaicho[c]Abstain[c][c]Windy[c]Windsor DC[c]Against[c]British Isles, Europeia, Democratium[c]DRUK[c]United Koryo[c]For[c]Osiris[c]King Durk the Awesome[c]Balkanlands[c]For[c][c]Empire of Narnia[c]Empire of Narnia[c]For[c][c]Kingborough[c]Kingborough II[c]Against[c]Nysa, Balder, British Isles, Lazarus[c]unibot[c]Unibot III[c]Abstain[c][c]punk d[c]MadhouseMike[c]For[c]The West Pacific[c]Mahaj[c]Sexy Cars[c]Against[c]Osiris[c]Lord Byron[c]God n Country n Byron[c]For[c][c]Former English Colony[c]Former English Colony[c]For[c][c]Alvino Castillon[c]Almaniania[c]Abstain[c][c]Grosseschnauzer[c]Grosseschnauzer[c]Against[c][c]Malvad[c]Malvad[c]Against[c][c]Thomas Insaniac[c]Eastern Hungry[c]For[c]British Isles[c]Scandigrad[c]Scandigrad[c]present[c][c]Pasargad[c]Pasargad[c]present[c][c]New Kervoskia[c]New Kervoskia[c]For[c]Osiris[c]Zaolat[c]Zaolat III[c]present[c]Osiris, The East Pacific[c]Govindia[c]Ramaba[c]For[c]Balder
 
I vote against the resolution.

I have voted in Taijitu, Osiris, and the Rejected Realms.




The WA Affairs Ministry recognizes 19 in favor, 15 against, 4 to abstain, and 3 present. As neither 19 nor 15 is a majority of 38, the Ministry would advise the Delegate to abstain from voting on the resolution at this time.

Voter[c]TNP Nation[c]Vote[c]Other Regions[c]Cormac Stark[c]Cormac Stark[c]Against[c][c]Joshua[c]The Dead Angels[c]For[c][c]Sovreignry[c]Sovreignry North Pacific[c]Against[c]Osiris[c]Blue Wolf II[c]Blue Wolf II[c]For[c][c]Mall[c]Mall[c]For[c]Osiris[c]madjack[c]United Alesia[c]Against[c]Balder, Europeia, the South pacific[c]Venico[c]Numpkys[c]For[c]Osiris[c]Jamie[c]Jamie Anumia[c]For[c]Balder[c]flemingovia[c]Northern Flemingovia[c]Against[c][c]Lennart[c]Ehlnar[c]Abstain[c][c]Funkadelia[c]Funkadelia Island[c]For[c]Taijitu[c]Belschaft[c]North Pacific Belschaft[c]Against[c]the South Pacific, Osiris[c]Ravania[c]Ravania Aquilonia[c]Against[c]Osiris[c]Johz[c]That Johz Thing[c]Against[c][c]Iro[c]Checkers[c]For[c]Atrigeas[c]Earth[c]Earth22 IV[c]Against[c]Osiris, The Rejected Realms[c]Tim[c]Tim[c]Against[c]Osiris, Balder, Mordor, Equilism[c]Bryan von Richthofen[c]Maybe I Should Join[c]For[c][c]Biyah[c]Lord Rahl Reloaded[c]For[c]Osiris, The Rejected Realms[c]Gaspo[c]Gasponia[c]For[c][c]Kiwi[c]KiwiTaicho[c]Abstain[c][c]Windy[c]Windsor DC[c]Against[c]British Isles, Europeia, Democratium[c]DRUK[c]United Koryo[c]For[c]Osiris[c]King Durk the Awesome[c]Balkanlands[c]For[c][c]Empire of Narnia[c]Empire of Narnia[c]For[c][c]Kingborough[c]Kingborough II[c]Against[c]Nysa, Balder, British Isles, Lazarus[c]unibot[c]Unibot III[c]Abstain[c][c]punk d[c]MadhouseMike[c]For[c]The West Pacific[c]Mahaj[c]Sexy Cars[c]Against[c]Osiris[c]Lord Byron[c]God n Country n Byron[c]For[c][c]Former English Colony[c]Former English Colony[c]For[c][c]Alvino Castillon[c]Almaniania[c]Abstain[c][c]Grosseschnauzer[c]Grosseschnauzer[c]Against[c][c]Malvad[c]Malvad[c]Against[c][c]Thomas Insaniac[c]Eastern Hungry[c]For[c]British Isles[c]Scandigrad[c]Scandigrad[c]present[c][c]Pasargad[c]Pasargad[c]present[c][c]New Kervoskia[c]New Kervoskia[c]For[c]Osiris[c]Zaolat[c]Zaolat III[c]present[c]Osiris, The East Pacific[c]Govindia[c]Ramaba[c]For[c]Balder[c]Eluvatar[c]Zemnaya Svoboda[c]Against[c]Taijitu, Osiris, The Rejected Realms
 
"Condemn The United Defenders League" was defeated 7,539 votes to 3,654.

Voting on this resolution has ended.

Thanks to those nations who cast their votes. Your participation is a great help to the region.

This topic has been locked and sent to the Archives for safekeeping. If you would like this topic to be re-opened for further discussion, please contact the WA Delegate, a Global Moderator, or an Administrator for assistance. Thank you.
 
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