Taijitu vs. TRR

I

Isimud

TNPer
Taijitu invades the Rejected Realms in order to enforce democracy. This is only made possible, because:
  1. Red Kagran, by some means, acquired the password to the Tajituan Founder's nation and was able to eject a large number of nations that had endorsed RK, without needing to rely on influence.
  2. The nature of TRR is such that all ejected nations end up there, and so when RK moved to TRR he became Delegate, with the aid of DEN (is that an acronym for anything?), by, rather effectively, conscripting those nations that he'd previously ejected from Taijitu.
  3. This was all timed so that it occurred just prior to update and RK became the Delegate of TRR by default.
Have I missed anything? And just what was accomplished, except some upheaval?
 
Don't forget that DEN is trying to take all the credit for the invasion of RR. :lol:

What a joke.

There is an impeachment vote underway in Taijitu.
 
I was expecting something like to happen months ago. My heart goes out to Kandarin and I hope order is returned to TRR as soon as possible.
 
Dalimbar:
As a member of Taijitu, what are your personal feelings regarding this distasteful invasion?
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My personal stance?

Well I would firstly say that the community of Taijitu is outraged that its reputation has been ruined by a tiny minority of its members and is desperately trying to make the rest of NationStates realize that they knew nothing of the plot and are as angry as everyone else.

My view is that although the plan was not original, it was certainly gutsy and I admire the cojones of the people involved, they certainly shook NationStates up a bit. But Kandy didn't deserve it and the plotters shouldn't have tried to hide behind the cowardly 'bring democracy to The Rejected Realms' bit and just admitted that they did it for the hell of it. So I hope that The Rejected Realms is returned to Kandarin on the next update and that Taijitu's reputation is not severely damaged and that the Supreme Court resolves the issue soon.
 
This is obviously why you voted against the withdrawal from TRR in the Taijituan Senate, but perhaps I'm daft and don't know anything. :shrug:
 
This is obviously why you voted against the withdrawal from TRR in the Taijituan Senate, but perhaps I'm daft and don't know anything.
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My thoughts exactly. Unless you (EM) want to convince me you aren't Durnia, but why even bother?
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No, Durnia is simply the nation I use in Taijitu. I have never used duality and do not intend to, I freely admit that I am Durnia and likewise. I voted against the proposal because I was trying to protest at how other members of Senate were rushing to try and convict various respected members of the Senate, when I believe they should have waited for more facts to come out and then the Supreme Court should then proceed with the matter, which it is by the way.

I hope this explanation clears up this little misunderstanding.
 
...

You voted to have Taijitu stay in the RR...as an act of protest against criminal proceedings that you perceived to be too rash?

First of all, you get a "heh" from me.

I must also say that this proposal that you voted against would have actually done something. Furthermore, it didn't make any value judgments against any individual. That is unless, of course, you saw such an order to be a premature attack against PoD's legal status?
 
Lord Valentine:
I was expecting something like to happen months ago. My heart goes out to Kandarin and I hope order is returned to TRR as soon as possible.
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You feel for Kandarin? He has been in power for over 2 years and TRR has not really changed in any significant ways has it?

I say it was due time for some new blood to be let into the position of UN Delegate in TRR. Change is good, change is necessary. Without change evolution cannot occur. ^_^
 
Joshua:
You feel for Kandarin? He has been in power for over 2 years and TRR has not really changed in any significant ways has it?

I say it was due time for some new blood to be let into the position of UN Delegate in TRR. Change is good, change is necessary. Without change evolution cannot occur. ^_^
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Surely the people of the Rejected Realms have the right to choose a new leader, should they wish, rather than having one forced upon them.
 
Byardkuria:
But, change!



CHANGE!

Stagnation!

Eventual heat-death of Nationstates!

Hurrr!
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Byard that was enlightening.

Surely the people of the Rejected Realms have the right to choose a new leader, should they wish, rather than having one forced upon them.
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Really? Oh how foolish of me not to realize this. I will believe it when I see that actually happening. Anyone who brings up the idea of a new leader, a government or change is pretty much sidelined.
 
Most of them are simply opportunistic invaders who pretend they are natives, who in my frank opinion (and having seen this again and again over my 3 years of playing) simply want the trophy of having TRR for themselves. I seem to remember that a certain someone here may have been involved in one of those operations, but perhaps I'm fogging up from "old" age?
 
Dalimbar:
Most of them are simply opportunistic invaders who pretend they are natives, who in my frank opinion (and having seen this again and again over my 3 years of playing) simply want the trophy of having TRR for themselves. I seem to remember that a certain someone here may have been involved in one of those operations, but perhaps I'm fogging up from "old" age?
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Nah, I don't think you are. I know of at least one person...
 
Josh, Very few of the actual natives have actually spoke out against Kandarin. As has been proven, his delegacy was never inassailable, and without native support he would not have remained for two years. He was popular and well liked by his people, and I don't think anyone but his people had the right to take his delegacy away.

Obviously, you believe otherwise. I wonder why ;)
 
Dalimbar:
Most of them are simply opportunistic invaders who pretend they are natives, who in my frank opinion (and having seen this again and again over my 3 years of playing) simply want the trophy of having TRR for themselves. I seem to remember that a certain someone here may have been involved in one of those operations, but perhaps I'm fogging up from "old" age?
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Dali,

I have nothing against you. But, given your recent stunt here in TNP are you really able to criticize past attempts to either unseat Kandarin or usher in change into a stagnant feeder region? The reason being for your stunt here was that TNP has become a stagnant and bloated beaurocracy herself.

Some of those same raiders you seem to despise, Dali, have probably at one point or another endorsed Kandarin since part of his support comes from endotarting.

And LV if you are alluding to my affiliation with DEN as motivation to not want Kandarin as UN Delegate you are sorely mistaken.
 
If anyone really thinks that the whole RR crapshoot was to bring the citizens of the RR a better life, I have a bridge I'd like to sell you.
 
And I've got some swampland to go with the bridge.

There is a great deal of difference between Dali's actions, an internal matter to TNP, and invasions of the RR.
 
Monte Ozarka:
If anyone really thinks that the whole RR crapshoot was to bring the citizens of the RR a better life, I have a bridge I'd like to sell you.
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Might want to re-read my post and realize I never said that. MO. Darius' and mine own attempt to create change in TRR was different from this invasion in TRR. And then Sarda before us, and so on.

The prevaling trend seems to be anyone who tries to create change in TRR is sidelined and berated.
 
Joshua:
Might want to re-read my post and realize I never said that. MO. Darius' and mine own attempt to create change in TRR was different from this invasion in TRR. And then Sarda before us, and so on.
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Whuh? I have no clue what you did in the RR; I was not judging whatever you did in the RR. I was commenting on the Taijitu/DEN invasion of the RR. The official line from Taijitu was to bring positive change and democracy to the RR. I roll my eyes at that.

The prevaling trend seems to be anyone who tries to create change ininvade TRRany region is  sidelined and berated.
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Fixed it up a bit for you.
 
Maybe that was their intention, or maybe it wasn't. I firmly believe change needs to happen in TRR. Stagnation and having the same people in power for over two years is not good for a region. While it provides stability it makes it tough to get new blood and ideas flowing into a region.

The invasion got NS wide attention and it hopefully woke some folks and helped them realize that change is possible in TRR.
 
You mean, Invasion of the RR is possible, right? We knew that already. Kandarin's position was always tenuous simply because he cannot eject people from the region.

My allusion was to what Darius and you were up to a couple of years back, not to your affiliation with DEN. I think you're still sore that people didn't take you seriously — which wasn't Kandarin's fault, I must point out.
 
Lord Valentine:
You mean, Invasion of the RR is possible, right? We knew that already. Kandarin's position was always tenuous simply because he cannot eject people from the region.

My allusion was to what Darius and you were up to a couple of years back, not to your affiliation with DEN. I think you're still sore that people didn't take you seriously —  which wasn't Kandarin's fault, I must point out.
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Not really LV. But, I appreciate you looking out for my well being. :eyeroll:

From what I remember the people who publically disagreed with us were few and far apart. I can remember it was the same 3 or 4 people on the forums, maybe 5 or 6 out of a region of over a thousand. Kandarin was one of the few foks who made a sound argument against us, even then I felt it was a bit uneven.

And Darius (Drunken Conquerors) had a wee bit over a hundred endos (maybe in the high 90's) which was pretty close to Kandarin's endo count. Yes it was from endo tarting, but TG's were sent to nations in TRR and Kandarin's endo count also comes from endo tarting as well.

If TRR is fine like it is and if 'most' folks in TRR feel that way. Then why should they feel threatened by talks of changing the region and opening the UN Delegate spot to someone else other then Kandarin? If Kandarin is so capable and widely loved in TRR then where is the worry and fear coming from?

Yes TRR is vulnerable to raiders as we have seen, but they seem to have many allies who can thwart any invasion anyways. So, why constantly berate and belittle people who want to propose changes to TRR?

Why not let these ideas of change fail on their own? By berating, belittling and going on the defensive it gives the perception that things are not fine and dandy in TRR. It gives the perception that the few folks who run TRR might have something to fear indeed.
 
Joshua:
If TRR is fine like it is and if 'most' folks in TRR feel that way. Then  why should they feel threatened by talks of changing the region and opening the UN Delegate spot to someone else other then Kandarin? If Kandarin is so capable and widely loved in TRR then where is the worry and fear coming from?
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Because someone outside a sovereign region is talking about changing that region - there is good reason to worry. That's a threat to the region. RR has the right of self-determination the same as any other region, and no one outside the region has any right to try to dictate the situation there. Whether it's stagnant or not is no one's business but theirs.
 
Let's just sum it all up and say that foreign armies make poor catalysts for popular change. An invading force can certainly force change, but good luck getting anyone to like it.
 
Lewis and Clark:
Because someone outside a sovereign region is talking about changing that region - there is good reason to worry. That's a threat to the region. RR has the right of self-determination the same as any other region, and no one outside the region has any right to try to dictate the situation there. Whether it's stagnant or not is no one's business but theirs.
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So, how long must you be in TRR to actually have the right to voice an opinion that there needs to be change? 1 day? 1 week? 1 Month? 1 year?

Let's just sum it all up and say that foreign armies make poor catalysts for popular change. An invading force can certainly force change, but good luck getting anyone to like it.
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Sometimes that is the case and others not the case. Killer Kitties ascendancy to the delegacy of Lazarus was not necessarily a bad thing for Lazarus. There are a few raiders in Lazarus who have been great catalysts for the evolution of that region.
 
And some regions will have nothing to do with them because they are invaders, to the detriment of Lazarus.

So, how long must you be in TRR to actually have the right to voice an opinion that there needs to be change? 1 day? 1 week? 1 Month? 1 year?
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Is there a point to this? There's all the right in the world to voice your opinion there. But if you come from outside the region with the intention to change the reigon, you're an interloper.
 
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