[Complete][At Vote] Condemn The CAIN

Pallaith

Pallaith

TNPer
-
-
-
-
Category: Condemnation
Nominee: The CAIN
Proposed by: Neo Danzig
Onsite Topic

The World Assembly,
Believing that the so-called "Coalition Against the Ideology of Nazism" (CAIN) doesn't speak for all regions and nations;
Aware that CAIN has taken it upon themselves to eradicate all regions they wish to label as "Nazi regions" or "Nazi collaborators";
Concerned that CAIN has labeled KAISERREICH as a Nazi region based solely on remarks jokingly made by their founder and emperor, which they rescinded and have since shown remorse for, and the imagery used by one nation in their dispatches, ignoring that it predates the ideology of Nazism;
Disturbed that CAIN labels all regions with embassies to so-called "Nazi regions" as "Nazi collaborators", thereby smearing the reputations of more than 100 innocent regions, including those led by Jews and those of Jewish descent;
Denouncing such reckless behavior as counterproductive to the anti-Nazi cause;
Hereby Condemns The CAIN.
Click to expand...

Please vote For, Against, Abstain, or Present
 
This resolution seeks to condemn the Coalition Against the Ideology of Nazism (CAIN), an interregional organization founded for the purpose of rooting out Nazism in NationStates. The author resides in the region KAISERREICH, which has been deemed a Nazi Region by CAIN on account of "...the use of Nazi Imagery in previous iterations of their off-site forums and sometimes blatant anti-Semitic tendencies from some of their leaders." The founder of the region, Scansinia, has made anti-Semitic comments on the Regional Message Board of Nazi Europa, with which KAISERREICH has an embassy. This condemnation clearly is without merit and the World Assembly should reject this as such.
 
Someone in discord said something to the effect of, "Choose your embassies carefully."


Against
 
flemingovia:
So is Kaiserreich a nazi region, then?
Click to expand...
Kaiserreich was classified as a Nazi region, with evidence presented on the on-site forum. Kaiserreich disputes this classification and considers itself an Imperial region.

If the evidence is doubtful, the region could be considered a Nazi Collaborator under Section 2(g) of the Treaty, as it does have an embassy with Nazi Europa.
Any region which voluntarily participates in a military operation alongside, or possesses an on-site embassy with, a Nazi Region shall be officially designated as Nazi Collaborators.

emphasis added
Click to expand...
 
flemingovia:
So is Kaiserreich a nazi region, then?
Click to expand...
The post above mine by Sil lists the public information that was released by the CAIN leadership. We are not privy to the CAIN discussions and votes that labeled KAISERREICH a Nazi region.
 
Against.

Oh I dunno, they had a public Nazi themed forum skin for a long time, and of course, has several officials who like to comment on the "Jewish plague".
 
Against.

I do however feel that labeling regions like A Bar on Every Corner and The Embassy as Nazi collaborators is rather off-putting and strict.
 
Yeraennus:
Against.

I do however feel that labeling regions like A Bar on Every Corner and The Embassy as Nazi collaborators is rather off-putting and strict.
Click to expand...
There are currently provisions to prevent this, according to a read-through of the CAIN treaty:
CAIN treaty:
(f) Any region may be removed from the officially designated list of Nazi Regions by a vote of three-fourths of signatories.
...
(h) Any region officially designated as a Nazi Collaborator shall be subjected to the same clauses as Nazi Regions with the exception of Section 2(g).
Click to expand...
 
Oh, I am against this too, obviously. It would be damaging to have TNP a signatory to a condemned treaty.

Also, the region cited in the condemnation has not done the things mentioned in the text.
 
Darcania:
CAIN treaty:
(f) Any region may be removed from the officially designated list of Nazi Regions by a vote of three-fourths of signatories.
...
(h) Any region officially designated as a Nazi Collaborator shall be subjected to the same clauses as Nazi Regions with the exception of Section 2(g).
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
I think it's unreasonable to expect CAIN to go through a hundred regions that have embassies with Kaiserreich and vote to remove them as Nazi Collaborators.

Maybe we should split this into a separate topic about the viability of the treaty. Oppose the condemnation but review whether this treaty is doing more harm than good as it is currently written, and propose amendments to it.
 
Sil Dorsett:
I think it's unreasonable to expect CAIN to go through a hundred regions that have embassies with Kaiserreich and vote to remove them as Nazi Collaborators.

Maybe we should split this into a separate topic about the viability of the treaty. Oppose the condemnation but review whether this treaty is doing more harm than good as it is currently written, and propose amendments to it.
Click to expand...
It is entirely unreasonable, which is why it doesn't happen. If a signatory believes a Nazi Collaborator shouldn't be in the list, boom.

I am, however, not privvy to the discussions of CAIN signatories. I simply read what I see in the treaty. If Plembobria (our current representative to CAIN) wishes to interject, I would welcome it. Alternatively, I am sure you could ask Brunhilde, since she administrates the decisions of the CAIN signatories and is the public "face" of the Coalition.
 
I am torn between voting in favour and urging to abstain. In any case, a vote against is plainly wrong.

CAIN conflates actually fighting against Nazis and playing an online game. In doing so, it cheapens the actual fight for the safety of those persecuted by Nazis.

The best example for this is naming their award after Simon Wiesenthal. If I did not know better, I'd joke that the Raoul Wallenberg Medal is next. Truly vomit-inducing, and actually quite insulting. No matter some's delusions of grandeur, CAIN is not actually fighting Nazis, and it is not befitting to appropriate Wiesenthal's name.

Worse, the reactions of several people involved in CAIN to disagreements with its missions have resulted in moralist, holier-than-thou responses.

On a less-important note, the efficacy of invading Nazi regions as means to discourage them is dubious at best.
 
CAIN is certainly having issues distinguishing between actual collaborators and embassy collectors or other groups. I have faith that there are competent people in place, however, to address those issues. Allowing CAIN to become a tool of certain factions to wield against ones enemies, both ideological and personal, massively cheapens its ideals and goals.

I do not believe CAIN and signatories have done enough to warrant a condemnation - but I do not have a vote in this matter.
 
CAIN has its faults as mentioned by previous posts on this thread, but by no means is CAIN condemnable. Therefore I am Against.
 
Darcania:
Sil Dorsett:
I think it's unreasonable to expect CAIN to go through a hundred regions that have embassies with Kaiserreich and vote to remove them as Nazi Collaborators.

Maybe we should split this into a separate topic about the viability of the treaty. Oppose the condemnation but review whether this treaty is doing more harm than good as it is currently written, and propose amendments to it.
Click to expand...
It is entirely unreasonable, which is why it doesn't happen. If a signatory believes a Nazi Collaborator shouldn't be in the list, boom.

I am, however, not privvy to the discussions of CAIN signatories. I simply read what I see in the treaty. If Plembobria (our current representative to CAIN) wishes to interject, I would welcome it. Alternatively, I am sure you could ask Brunhilde, since she administrates the decisions of the CAIN signatories and is the public "face" of the Coalition.
Click to expand...
It's ok, but I can.
 
Voting on this resolution has ended.

Thanks to those nations who cast their votes. Your participation is a great help to the region.

This topic has been locked and sent to the Archives for safekeeping. If you would like this topic to be re-opened for further discussion, please contact the WA Delegate, a Global Moderator, or an Administrator for assistance. Thank you.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top