Plembobria-Ceretis History

[Ceretis]

A discussion laying out historic encounters between Plembobria and Ceretis which will determine a clearer nature of the neighbor relationship. Generally I'd assume it to be mostly involving the two nations, but I would also be open to other nations taking part especially neighboring states at points as long as Plembobria gives an OK.

 

[plembobria]

I'll start with the war of unification. Here is a map of the land controlled by the Dynasties at the very start of the war (1784) superimposed over the modern province boundaries:

The first thing to discuss is the relationship of Ceretis to these dynasties. The house of Frithia or perhaps Pyr could have had close relations with Ceretis, or at least could have tried to gain their support.

I'm not sure that the Ceretian border was even this far south at the time.

Another possible story is that the House of Frithia could have had more land farther north, but it was conquered from them by Ceretis.

 

[Ceretis]

One thing I noticed:
The seven kings were very war like, supported slavery, etc and that they were not Rethenites Lore: Plembobria. If they happened to be of the 'Foxek' clans (Western kingdoms Ceretis fought against) or aligned with them, I'm almost sure that would have led to either strained relations or even war with the Ceretians.

 

[Ceretis]

At this time of history would probably have been the time of the great expansion. Ceretis only spanned the North, Center, and Western sections it controls. There were nomadic close cousins of Ceretis that successfully petitioned Lord Francis Callahan for inclusion due to the possibility of being swallowed up by their neighbors (Plembobria, etc)

This could have led to a border conflict when the expansion happened where Frithia lost land. This could also tie in with the Foxek issue if you're interested in blending the histories a bit.

I can see the possibility that Pyr might have had some sort of relationship with Ceretis, to what type or extent I do not know. I also see the Liberty League (LL) being something that Ceretis might have been interested in supporting if the right conditions presented themselves. Though we aren't interested in covert intervention so much these days, it may have been something a previous leader/administration might have supported.

 

[plembobria]

Well none of the seven kings were in the west of the continent, so they would not be related to the Foxek clans. So the Ceretians were not friends of the Dynasties.

The other possibility is Ceretian involvement in War of Unification. The Southern Liberty league was assisted by the Clethels (The Clethels were a 'nice' regime. They did not permit slavery, and legitimately wanted to form a sort of German-style confederation.) The Southern League began their conquest from Clethel territory, pressed east, and continued north. (This land became Flithendale.)

The Northern League could have potentially been assisted by the Ceretians. Their conquest started near the border with Ceretis, and moved to the south-east. It was eventually halted by the Eastern Mountains, which still define the border of modern-day Pyrandia and Crilalia.

Map of modern provinces for reference:

 

[plembobria]

This could have led to a border conflict when the expansion happened where Frithia lost land. This could also tie in with the Foxek issue if you're interested in blending the histories a bit.

This could make sense.

I can see the possibility that Pyr might have had some sort of relationship with Ceretis, to what type or extent I do not know.

Pyr was the most truly evil of the Dynasties. Their military was the most brutal. That's partly why recruiting for the LL became so easy.

 

[Ceretis]

Ceretis would have most likely not been friends with the dynasties, but among the dynasties would have found the Clethels the more agreeable of the group. With Pyr being the most aggressive and evil of the dynasties, might have initially thought they found an ally when the great expansion occoured. (Seeing the battle between Ceretis and Frithia.)

(When I mentioned the Foxek, they were not from our land but from some other area. Seemed similar to the dynasty kings coming from some other land. I thought maybe some might have landed in the east while the one we knew as the 'Foxek' landed in the west. But still if you retain them as unrelated they are unrelated.)

We would be open to the idea of assisting the Northern League. Especially if given the option for a peaceful or less warlike government vs keeping warmongering slavers on the border.

I do wonder what actually led to Ceretis taking part of Frithia. Did they maybe take captive some of our nomadic clansmen? Frithia thought they could take Ceretis? Something else?

 

[plembobria]

I suspect Frithia simply would have tried to expand its borders north by attacking the Ceretians.

As for assistance to the Northern League, what kind was it? Monetary? Arms? Getting weapons at the time would be the most onerous burden, since mass production of muskets wasn't really much of a thing back then. Most of the weapons they had were stolen.

 

[Ceretis]

Support for the northern league would have been a combination I'd suspect. I can see providing weapons, training, and limited financing to help the cause.
Weapons captured during the war between Frithia and Ceretis could have been collected and given to the league along with weapons from our armory filling in what's missing. The war probably would have been a bit costly on the treasury especially after the recent 'great expansion.' I would see some financing going to the league though by reason of national security.

If some element or leadership of the northern league assisted Ceretis in the Frithia conflict, they'd probably have gained a respect in the Ceretian government. This past support could have led to their case being made for support in the league matters.

 

[plembobria]

Well, it's decided that Ceretis granted aid to the Northern League during the war.

I think we should decide on a time period in which Frithia was at war with Ceretis. The Northern League would have been limited in assisting Ceretis, though. However, Ceretis could have used the Northern League as a sort of proxy to spark rebellion in Frithia.

I think it is important to explain something that I haven't made clear. (Which is entirely my fault.) The Liberty League's underground operations were far greater than their military ones. They accomplished their goal partly by getting military leaders (and by extension, all their subordinate troops) to switch their loyalty to the League. They did assassinate some. (It's possible that the Ceretions might have found this rather objectionable.) Each dynasty's downfall (except for Pyr) was due more to civil destabilization than open-armed conflict; it was essentially a series of coup d'etats. The conquest of Pyr was not so much to take land, but rather to keep Pyr's military occupied. As a result, the control they gained over the other dynasties was not threatened by Pyr's aggression.

 

[plembobria]

bump?

 

[Xentherida]

I would also like to have some involvement in this history thread. The fact that, after the Despotoan Coup of 1772, Xentherida essentially turned into the warmongering hell-hole known as Despotoa. Potentially, this regime could have supported Pyr or one of the more brutal dynasties, using Despotoa's powerful navy to ship troops, or after a an acquisition of southern-Ceretian/Tombian land, during one of its many military conquests.

 

[Ceretis]

I don't object to adding in Xen if you don't Plem. (Could be interesting.)

I was thinking that it's possible the war between Ceretis and Frithia could have started around 1734 as a series of skirmishes and raids by Frithia into Ceretian territory. These raids would have been to test the Ceretian military as well as provide resources for Frithia's Dynastic era war machine. The raids would have been contained to the border lands and towns. By about 1762 the situation might have become more of a serious threat changing from minor border raids to a military incursion.

I can picture that this might have taken an serious and sudden turn if there was an attack on say Iemso. The city was the western most major city of the kingdom at the time, and is the Oblast (state/province) capital.

Spoiler: Modern map locations

I like the idea of the Northern League as a proxy sparking conflict in Frithia.
I could see Ceretis NOT continuing the Frithia campaign after seeing the underground Northern League growing in strength. This would have eased fears of continued conflict. This and maybe the additional concerns of Pyr becoming involved. Maybe there is some sort of natural defensive position along the current border? (This could be another/additional reason the advance stopped.)

If Xen is included:
It's also possible that some time around 1775 Despotoa (Xentherida) and Pyr may have become allies and began threatening the safety of Ceretis leading to a cessation of hostilities with Frithia. The threat may have been two pronged, at Pyr and south Ceretis. At this point the Ceretian army and navy may have set themselves into a defensive posture and solidified the hold on the lands they took from Frithia. They would have also strengthened the border defenses along the Despotoa border. I know Despotoa did not come up to the Ceretian border at this time, but there may have been troops sent by Despotoa to the border as well as navy battles. As well as possible skirmishes with Pyr and Despotoa on land and sea. This could be a reason no further assistance was given at the time of unification for Plembobria, as we'd have been occupied.

 

[plembobria]

As far as I'm concerned, all nation's currently on our continent are entitled to participate here.

I am for all the ideas on posted by Ceretis.

Pyr and Despotoa could have been allies. This could explain Pyr's superiority to the other dynasties.

 

[Ceretis]

Hmmm, what to discuss next?

 

[plembobria]

Well, it seems that most discussion so far has been about Plembobrian unification; focused mostly on my nation. Now that we are past the point of both nations actually existing, I think we should begin discussing bilateral relations between Plembobria and Ceretis over the years. Xen can chime in as well.

 

[Ceretis]

There are a few questions regarding the war:
Was Iemso paced under siege by Frithia?
Were there any naval or land battles? (Pyr)
I like the idea of starting on the bilateral (Plem/Cere) / Trilateral (Plem/Cere/Xen) relations over the years.
When did the relationship between Ceretis and the new Plembobria begin to take formal shape? (Right away or was there a lull after the transition?)



Thoughts for Plem and Xen:
After the coup d'etat / Northern and Southern league action started, did Despota take action or try and take advantage?



Thoughts for Xen:
Did Despotoa and Ceretis get into Naval battles or land battles?
What is Despotoa's take on the situation or history around this time?
I know that this was the transition from Xentherida to Despota (1772):
Was Despota as large as it was before the border expansion you recently did in RP? What were your thoughts?



Xentherida mentioned Tomb; shall we see if we can get Tomb involved?

 

[Xentherida]

Thoughts for Plem and Xen:
After the coup d'etat / Northern and Southern league action started, did Despota take action or try and take advantage?



Thoughts for Xen:
Did Despotoa and Ceretis get into Naval battles or land battles?
What is Despotoa's take on the situation or history around this time?
I know that this was the transition from Xentherida to Despota (1772):
Was Despota as large as it was before the border expansion you recently did in RP? What were your thoughts?



Xentherida mentioned Tomb; shall we see if we can get Tomb involved?

1) Of course Despotoa tried to take advantage; it's heavily militaristic. There could potentially have been a failed invasion by sea, or itself tried (and failed) to coup Pyr, or another region. Despotoa has no whims nor cares, and would happily double-cross its allies.

2) It depends on your navy at the time. Mine was powerful, but not on the lake on the inside, as Port Ashby hadn't been built by then. Also, we didn't have a border at that time, but it would be likely that we tried to seize land from you at least three times.

3) Despotoa is a very aggressive nation, so we would have tried to make it our way. However, despite our power, we weren't usually very successful, due to the utter hatred of the rulers of Despotoa at the time; in fact, almost 35% of soldiers fighting against a nation surrendered immediately, to go into the custody of other nations.

4) No, the expansion was quite recent. It was performed after the Great Xentheridan Revolution, so no, Despotoa was the same size as I originally claimed on the map.

Here's another thing: Xentherida had its Great Revolution in 1848, where, after dissent in Blackwater City, the revolution spread from east to west, starting with Cosonia, and spreading all the way to Despotoa's capital, Aridia. There could be involvement from either of you; helping/suppressing the revolution, or even help us plan to assassinate "The Most Glorious Dear Leader".

 

[Ceretis]

#1 This could pose some interest, that will have to be discussed more.

#2 I believe the navy at the time was not very powerful nor was it unprepared. The naval academy and facilities prepared good officers and sailors that allowed for a smaller more effective navy. The navy was mostly concerned with lake and coastal defense with little need to extend its power any great distance. This lack of need resulted in the smaller but skilled navy. However the navy did supplemented its ability with armed merchant vessels and privateers when needed. Our land had defenses such as strategic fortifications assisting in protecting the coast from invasion which further reduced the need for a large navy.

The Army, Marines, and Royal Guard however were much more powerful. During the Foxek Wars, Ceretis unified under the Treaty of Oleander under clan Oleander. One of the earliest actions of the new nation was compulsory military or intelligence service. Vowing to never repeat of the defeats and humiliations of the early Foxek War, the government has maintained this policy. Years later would see the formation of the military academies further sharpening the land forces.

The limitation on the military at this time would have been the dilution and reconstruction due to the Great Expansion, the expending of forces and treasury during the Frithian Incursion.
I can see there being attempts to seize land by Despotoa especially if the perceive a weakened state.

#3 Ouch. But could play into the foreign legion or auxiliaries. This could also lead to a modern day series of events with Ceretian citizens who have Xentherida heritage, cultural events, or other ideas.

#4 I should clarify what I meant, I was asking if Despota upon formation from original Xentherida was as large as your original claim. If it was not, how did it grow? Did you conquer local tribes or gain land through conquest of NPC nations. A situation such as this would lead Plem and I to have a better understanding of our historic relationship with your nation based on this.

Also discussion of the Great Revolution of 1848 and "The Most Glorious Dear Leader" will have to be discussed further.

 

[Ceretis]

There are a few questions regarding the war:
Was Iemso paced under siege by Frithia?
Were there any naval or land battles? (Pyr)
I like the idea of starting on the bilateral (Plem/Cere) / Trilateral (Plem/Cere/Xen) relations over the years.
When did the relationship between Ceretis and the new Plembobria begin to take formal shape? (Right away or was there a lull after the transition?)

This is a bump for Xentherida and Plembobria (Plembobria, questions above and below. Xentherida prior post.)

Also add in there this question for Plembobria:
Since the oblast of North Frithia contains a lot of native Plembobrians, that might have led to a lot interest in international travel between North Frithia and Frithia as families want to visit each other. Would this have caused your nation much issue?

Also, what about the dead soldiers from (South) Frithia? Dead Ceretian soldiers are our problem, and I guess North Frithians might as well? Are you considering dead Frithian soldiers not historically Plembobrian? Should their bodies be repatriated? Should they be buried in a war cemetery in North Frithia? Do you want to run that cemetery like the Normandy American Cemetery and Memorial in France or is it ours alone?

 

[Ceretis]

Bump

 

[plembobria]

Since the oblast of North Frithia contains a lot of native Plembobrians, that might have led to a lot interest in international travel between North Frithia and Frithia as families want to visit each other. Would this have caused your nation much issue?

It's hard to say, immediately after the Unification, Plembobria entered a sort of power vacuum. There was little to no border control to speak of. When the Kingdom was proclaimed, Frithia was immediately reorganized as the Province of Northelfrith. At that point there would be some kind inquiry into who was a citizen of Plembobria and who was not. Travel I guess was temporarily restricted until the end of 1799.

Also, what about the dead soldiers from (South) Frithia? Dead Ceretian soldiers are our problem, and I guess North Frithians might as well? Are you considering dead Frithian soldiers not historically Plembobrian? Should their bodies be repatriated? Should they be buried in a war cemetery in North Frithia? Do you want to run that cemetery like the Normandy American Cemetery and Memorial in France or is it ours alone?

I suppose their bodies were repatriated. Plembobria also wanted little to do with Frithian soldiers as well, since they were technically the enemy.

 

[plembobria]

Question for Ceretis (and Xen): how quick was your country to recognize the Kingdom once it was proclaimed? Would you have sent ambassadors?

 

[Xentherida]

#4 I should clarify what I meant, I was asking if Despotoa upon formation from original Xentherida was as large as your original claim. If it was not, how did it grow? Did you conquer local tribes or gain land through conquest of NPC nations. A situation such as this would lead Plem and I to have a better understanding of our historic relationship with your nation based on this.

Nope, before the expansion, Xentherida-and Despotoa- were the same size as they were when Xentherida was founded. While Despotoa did try to conquer various parts of land, it didn't formally annex them; after all, the only purpose of this conquering was to bring terror upon the region. In fact, most of the areas acquired by Despotoa was in fact burnt, although the damaged was quickly repaired by the fall of Despotoa.

Also, to your question, Plem, Despotoa did not recognise the Kingdom, nor did it send diplomats. An actual diplomatic relation was established in 1849, when after the clean-up of the Great Revolution, Xentherida finally attempted to secure diplomatic relations with other nations, especially to the ones affected by Despotoa's ravaging of the land.

 

[Ceretis]

I would have to say my government did not immediately officially recognize Plembobria as it would have been too unstable to determine if it was a nation or if it was lawless. (Due to the power vacuum.) We would not have assigned an ambassador to the nation at this time, but would have sent diplomatic envoys to determine what Plembobria is, who is running the nation, and where it is being run from. This would have been handled as a precursor to official recognition and assignment of an official ambassador.

In most respects this envoy would be an ambassador, and represent the interests of Ceretis, and relay any diplomatic information/communications from your nation you chose to send. We would only assign the official ambassador once we find out whom takes control of the nation, and where the capital is located.

 

[Ceretis]

At that point there would be some kind inquiry into who was a citizen of Plembobria and who was not.

Interesting. Who might not be a citizen, and where would they have gone? Were there large numbers of these people?

 

[Ceretis]

3) Despotoa is a very aggressive nation, so we would have tried to make it our way. However, despite our power, we weren't usually very successful, due to the utter hatred of the rulers of Despotoa at the time; in fact, almost 35% of soldiers fighting against a nation surrendered immediately, to go into the custody of other nations.

Since we were at war, and your great leader existed. Would we have had to deal with a number of civilian and military refugees? Might there be descendants Xentheridians living in Ceretis?

Here's another thing: Xentherida had its Great Revolution in 1848, where, after dissent in Blackwater City, the revolution spread from east to west, starting with Cosonia, and spreading all the way to Despotoa's capital, Aridia. There could be involvement from either of you; helping/suppressing the revolution, or even help us plan to assassinate "The Most Glorious Dear Leader".

I think we might be in the business of helping to remove the glorious leader... especially if he became a thorn in our side and such.

 

[plembobria]

I would have to say my government did not immediately officially recognize Plembobria as it would have been too unstable to determine if it was a nation or if it was lawless. (Due to the power vacuum.) We would not have assigned an ambassador to the nation at this time, but would have sent diplomatic envoys to determine what Plembobria is, who is running the nation, and where it is being run from. This would have been handled as a precursor to official recognition and assignment of an official ambassador.

In most respects this envoy would be an ambassador, and represent the interests of Ceretis, and relay any diplomatic information/communications from your nation you chose to send. We would only assign the official ambassador once we find out whom takes control of the nation, and where the capital is located.

Okay. The land that is now Rethel was immediately designated as the location of a capital. This city wouldn't really be completed until quite a while afterward. The de facto capital was Cummings, Flithendale. Cummings was previously known as Eastford. Eastford was the Capital of the Pyr's dominion. After this city was taken in May 1798, the Pyr's surrendered. The power vacuum (known in Plembobria as "The 2nd Anarchy") lasted from then until around early 1800. (Again the Kingdom itself was proclaimed in March 1799.) The new government basically used Pyr's palace and other buildings.

I'll say this, not long after the establishment of the Kingdom, Egbert would have sent a diplomat bearing a letter to your nation's leader, requesting formal recognition, and assistance in legitimizing his rule. How he or she reacted is up to you.

At that point there would be some kind inquiry into who was a citizen of Plembobria and who was not.

Interesting. Who might not be a citizen, and where would they have gone? Were there large numbers of these people?

I'll further elaborate here. Crudely put, the new government needed to really find out what they were ruling. Vaguely similar to William the Conqueror's Domesday book.

The new government, like most post-revolutionary regimes was somewhat radically egalitarian. The government intended to give many former slaves a fair share of land. They also didn't want any Ceretians to attempt to "cash in" on this by entering the country and masquerading as Plembobrians. It also wanted to make sure any Frithian war-criminals didn't run off to Ceretis. These are largely the reasons for restricting travel. For the most part the new government defined "citizen" as a person born within the boundaries of Plembobria. I would say some native Plembobrians might have entered Ceretis during the war, just to get away from the fighting. It's also tenable that, before the war, many slaves would have ran away to Ceretis. If, of course, Ceretis would have them. The government would have held these people to be entitled to certain rights.

 

[plembobria]

I think we might be in the business of helping to remove the glorious leader... especially if he became a thorn in our side and such.

That is likely.

 

[Xentherida]

3) Despotoa is a very aggressive nation, so we would have tried to make it our way. However, despite our power, we weren't usually very successful, due to the utter hatred of the rulers of Despotoa at the time; in fact, almost 35% of soldiers fighting against a nation surrendered immediately, to go into the custody of other nations.

Since we were at war, and your great leader existed. Would we have had to deal with a number of civilian and military refugees? Might there be descendants Xentheridians living in Ceretis?

Here's another thing: Xentherida had its Great Revolution in 1848, where, after dissent in Blackwater City, the revolution spread from east to west, starting with Cosonia, and spreading all the way to Despotoa's capital, Aridia. There could be involvement from either of you; helping/suppressing the revolution, or even help us plan to assassinate "The Most Glorious Dear Leader".

I think we might be in the business of helping to remove the glorious leader... especially if he became a thorn in our side and such.

Yes, you would've had to deal with a lot of military refugees, but not so many civilians; emigrating to another country was illegal in Despotoa, and there were many, many guards at the border who prevented their escape. If civilians managed to get past, it would be thousands at a time, although these breakthroughs were rare. Most of them successfully managed to flee to either Ceretis, Tomb or Plembobria, some of them became integrated in the nearby tribes, although a few of them died in the wilderness.

You could have also been a potential supplier of the rebels, or even could have donated troops. And of course, any involvement in the assassination of The Most Glorious Dear Leader would have been welcomed by the rebels; they were moderately disorganized and without any real plan, so leaders of Ceretis could have organized the event for the rebels.

By the way Ceretis, would there have been any potential wars from 1750-1850 that Despotoa could have become involved in? Despotoa could have supported one party, or even attempted to invade Ceretis during a time of particular instability/anarchy. Or even any other wars outside that time frame that Xentherida could have potentially tried to solve (although, prior to the coup and revolution, they weren't particularly good at diplomacy).

 

[Ceretis]

I'll say this, not long after the establishment of the Kingdom, Egbert would have sent a diplomat bearing a letter to your nation's leader, requesting formal recognition, and assistance in legitimizing his rule. How he or she reacted is up to you.

By the sounds of this it held reasonable stability. We would have sent envoys to observe (secretly) that the government is as it seems, and most likely very shortly given official recognition and initial support to Egbert. After observing that his regime did not become like the Dynasties, we would have granted further support.

For the most part the new government defined "citizen" as a person born within the boundaries of Plembobria. I would say some native Plembobrians might have entered Ceretis during the war, just to get away from the fighting. It's also tenable that, before the war, many slaves would have ran away to Ceretis. If, of course, Ceretis would have them. The government would have held these people to be entitled to certain rights.

I would expect that there would have been some native Plembobrians that would have left during the war for Ceretis or Tomb. Also slavery is/was illegal in Ceretis and I'd imagine that'd have been quite attractive for slaves. We would have allowed them to enter as any immigrant, through the INS centers. There would be no restriction placed on Plembobrian slaves or citizens returning to Plembobria if they desire. Ceretis remains with an open immigration policy with minor restrictions (e.g. security, disease, etc) and allows free travel with certain restrictions (e.g. security, etc.) I'd expect some may desire to return as they were only here because of the war. However I'd expect some may have either decided to permanently stay or may stay due to having built a life they don't want to uproot.

 

[Ceretis]

Yes, you would've had to deal with a lot of military refugees, but not so many civilians... If civilians managed to get past, it would be thousands at a time, although these breakthroughs were rare. Most of them successfully managed to flee to either Ceretis, Tomb or Plembobria, some of them became integrated in the nearby tribes, although a few of them died in the wilderness.

So most likely Xentherida military and civilian refugees formed communities somewhere in my nation. It might have taken more time to process the military defectors through INS though. Since there were a large number of military defectors, did any take navy ships or other equipment with them? (Like the N Korean pilot that defected with the latest MIG.)[/quote]

You could have also been a potential supplier of the rebels, or even could have donated troops. And of course, any involvement in the assassination of The Most Glorious Dear Leader would have been welcomed by the rebels; they were moderately disorganized and without any real plan, so leaders of Ceretis could have organized the event for the rebels.

As Plem seems to be in agreement, I think the rebels might have gained support from both Ceretis and Plembobria at some point. I'd assume at first we'd have not been providing support to the rebels. I'm sure there would have been some sort of material support from citizens in Ceretis though. Only after Despota seems to not stop attacking or in some other way makes themselves a thorn in our and at some point Plembobria's side would the rebels probably start getting aid from the governments.

Most likely we'd provide special forces commando types for organizational, leadership, and training personnel rather than all out troops, until maybe the final push at the end. Also, if the border was heavily guarded, there would have been shipments of weapons and such only when it was possible.

By the way Ceretis, would there have been any potential wars from 1750-1850 that Despotoa could have become involved in?

As far as I can tell at the moment there were a few events. (There may be others as well):
1734 - 1762 Border skirmishes with Frithia
1762 - 1775/1776 Frithian-Ceretian war
1775/1776 - ?1797 Skirmish wars with Pyr, Possible navy battles with Despota
1808 - 1827 TWP Western colonial wars over the 'Polar bear islands' and 'Sedrok territory.' (You are maritime.)
I'd expect your great leader would have tried a few different times to invade by land or sea.
Also I'm open to you attempting to resolve some sort of dispute. When did the original Xentherida exist? That would help determine if it would be a historic or more modern event.

 

[Xentherida]

Yes, you would've had to deal with a lot of military refugees, but not so many civilians... If civilians managed to get past, it would be thousands at a time, although these breakthroughs were rare. Most of them successfully managed to flee to either Ceretis, Tomb or Plembobria, some of them became integrated in the nearby tribes, although a few of them died in the wilderness.

So most likely Xentherida military and civilian refugees formed communities somewhere in my nation. It might have taken more time to process the military defectors through INS though. Since there were a large number of military defectors, did any take navy ships or other equipment with them? (Like the N Korean pilot that defected with the latest MIG.

You could have also been a potential supplier of the rebels, or even could have donated troops. And of course, any involvement in the assassination of The Most Glorious Dear Leader would have been welcomed by the rebels; they were moderately disorganized and without any real plan, so leaders of Ceretis could have organized the event for the rebels.

As Plem seems to be in agreement, I think the rebels might have gained support from both Ceretis and Plembobria at some point. I'd assume at first we'd have not been providing support to the rebels. I'm sure there would have been some sort of material support from citizens in Ceretis though. Only after Despota seems to not stop attacking or in some other way makes themselves a thorn in our and at some point Plembobria's side would the rebels probably start getting aid from the governments.

Most likely we'd provide special forces commando types for organizational, leadership, and training personnel rather than all out troops, until maybe the final push at the end. Also, if the border was heavily guarded, there would have been shipments of weapons and such only when it was possible.

By the way Ceretis, would there have been any potential wars from 1750-1850 that Despotoa could have become involved in?

As far as I can tell at the moment there were a few events. (There may be others as well):
1734 - 1762 Border skirmishes with Frithia
1762 - 1775/1776 Frithian-Ceretian war
1775/1776 - ?1797 Skirmish wars with Pyr, Possible navy battles with Despota
1808 - 1827 TWP Western colonial wars over the 'Polar bear islands' and 'Sedrok territory.' (You are maritime.)
I'd expect your great leader would have tried a few different times to invade by land or sea.
Also I'm open to you attempting to resolve some sort of dispute. When did the original Xentherida exist? That would help determine if it would be a historic or more modern event.

Military defectors occasionally took firearms, but nothing big like navy ships or artillery pieces. They would feign death or flee from the battlefield, hide for a week or so and then flock in droves towards another country. They wouldn't taken a navy ship because only the higher ranks-who were practically brainwashed, they showed so much devotion to Despotoa's leader- would have tortured any soldiers who they discovered were planning to surrender. However, eventually the soldiers performed a few mutinies when their fear and hatred of fighting overtook their fear of the higher ranked men, and brought about two ships with them as they surrendered and asked for asylum.
There could also be a couple of settlements in Ceretis that were founded by refugees.
However, navy fighting only really happened at around 1800 onwards, and any sea invasion of Ceretis would have been from the ocean on the north, rather than the central lake. I'm also planning to make a factbook story about a colony that Despotoa managed to keep hold of, called the "Silvia Peninsula Colony". It was founded in 1812 and is on the south-west continent, near Syrixia and Funkadelia.
And in answer to your final question, the original Xentherida was founded in 400AD, after the War of Unification or something along the lines; it isn't set in stone quite yet. Nonetheless, it is a very old nation.
In the mean time, however, I have a few questions for you and Plembobria:
1) When was your founded/unified? What was before that; small clans/states, or was it all founded at once?
2) What would your nation's reaction be to both the Coup of Despotoa and the Great Xentheridan revolution?
3) When would diplomatic relations be started? Would there have been any before the coup, or for more brutal regions, during the Despotoan Era?
4) Would there have been any co-operation before/after the coup? Support in small conflicts (such as against the remnants of

 

[Syrixia]

Sorry to barge in, but I'd try and not place the Silvia Peninsula Colony on my end of the continent. This was the Syrixian Empire around 1814. It was at its maximum extent and had been that way for a while.

Spoiler

 

[Xentherida]

It's not that close.

Spoiler: Zoomed In Image

Spoiler: Zoomed Out Image

Only a tiny bit north of Andulus. I'm writing up a history for it right now.

 

[Ceretis]

In the mean time, however, I have a few questions for you and Plembobria:
1) When was your founded/unified? What was before that; small clans/states, or was it all founded at once?
2) What would your nation's reaction be to both the Coup of Despotoa and the Great Xentheridan revolution?
3) When would diplomatic relations be started? Would there have been any before the coup, or for more brutal regions, during the Despotoan Era?
4) Would there have been any co-operation before/after the coup? Support in small conflicts (such as against the remnants of

- Ceretis formed from several smaller kingdoms at the time of the Foxek wars. The kingdoms faced an overwhelming Foxek force and realized their choice was either to fall to the Foxek or unify into one nation. They chose unification in the Treaty of Oleander on 14 April 966. The original kingdoms dates of founding stretched even further back. (Their history has not been determined yet except for the point of the Foxek wars.)

- Coup of Despota being for all intents and purposes means N Kora near our border. After seeing the situation take hold and realizing what it is now. We'd have been very unhappy with this situation, we'd have sought to keep a distance to prevent problems in our own nation. We'd also have sought to end the problematic situation to our south and bring about something more civilized. But we would have most likely done this in a quiet, non threatening, secretive manner.
Great Xentheridan revolution being the restoration of a healthy nation to our south. We'd have been glad to see this happen and would have been working to these ends.

- There would have been relations between the kingdoms and later Ceretis and original Xentherida. I would assume limited relations between Ceretis and Despota especially if they sided with out enemies. After the revolution we would have been somewhat cautious to see if it was another Despota or the new Xentherida. We'd have been glad of a new more stable, peaceful, etc Xentherida.

- There would be not much support for Despota, but support for Xentherida or its remnants. Also Q4 is incomplete. "(such as against the remnants of." Remnants of... original Xentherida?
Also before the coup forming Despota we would have worked with Xentherida most likely.

 

[Xentherida]

Also Q4 is incomplete. "(such as against the remnants of." Remnants of... original Xentherida?

Thanks for telling me. The full question was "Would there have been any co-operation before/after the coup? Support in small conflicts (such as against the remnants of Despotoa).

By that, I mean any of the brainwashed psychos higher up in Despotoa, who would still attempt to amass a (rather small and reluctant) army, in an attempt to counter coup. The two years after the Great Xentheridan Revolution were also called the "Vacuum years", as there was a small power vacuum, with a little bit of instability caused by the remnants of Despotoa. However. control was finally asserted by Christian II, the leader of the rebellion and the new king. Once the power vacuum and chaos had disappeared, he finally made Xentherida a constitutional monarchy.

 

[Ceretis]

We would have been on the side of Christian II / Counter Despota forces before, during, and after the removal of Despota. We would be quiet about being in support sending only key people and equipment and other assistance where needed in a manner that was secret or could be explained away. In the final push we would have been willing to send troops, supplies, etc.

 

[Ceretis]

Plembobria, since we both have royal houses, is there any connection between our royal families?

Also, Xen, you have royalty as well. Are there any connections?

 

[Xentherida]

We do, although this was abolished during the Despotoan age. Any connections would have to be before or after it. I'm currently making a family tree, and there could be marriages between the monarchies.