Recall Eluvatar, the Delegate

Romanoffia

Romanoffia

Garde à l'eau!
Tim and Wham banned me from the IRC #TNP channel because I won't worship at the alter of their candidate for President of the United States.

Elu, another worshiper, supported their ban.

I have the entire logs which I will publish on an independent site beyond the scope of this site or TNP government ( so there!).

I have been a loyal citizen and supporter of this region an its legitimate elected governments for at least 10 years or in otherwise, since day one.

Elu crapped on me. He obviously doesn't support those who voted him in or supported him. It's time for him to go.

Now, given this level of disloyalty to one of his supporters, does Elu deserve our continued support ofter the cornholing of someone as loyal to TNP as me? I think not. And his foreign policy is a joke too as he screws over a region that simply changed his government.

He let "Tim" and "Wham" speak for him in banning me from #TNP for calling Obama an Incompetent. So much for freedom of speech in TNP or otherwise. Speak out against Herr Delegators opinon (or his dominion thughs) and get silenced! Freedom!

Freedom is Slavery. Have you ever read 1984 by George Orwell? You had better if not yet.

So, until The North Pacific gets the nads to free itself, don't count on me to help any more (once again, again, again, again, etc.,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,). You are on your own. I'm fed up with freeing people who don't apparently want to be free.

You had better all decide what you want before someone decides for you.

Woops! Someone already did!~


And that's what you get for hanging our your loyal supporters, Elu. I hope you sleep well. I will, knowing what you have coming. The people will speak!

So, add to this list why Elu should be
 
Firstly. Let me clarify as a few things. I'm backing the ban of you. Fully. Also, #tnp doesn't have 'freedom of speech' (nor, is the channel regulated by TNP Law). We allow people to hold opinions providing they don't make comments generalising entire groups of people and offending channel members. All bans from the channel are justified. I believe this ban was more than justified. No. I'm not supporting a recall for Eluvatar as delegate. He hasn't done anything wrong.
 
Roman, we have been side by side here since some of this community were in infant school. I have no desire to see you walk away after so long, and no desire to see anyone end their time in TNP on a sour note.

You have given hundreds of hours to this region, in times of war and peace. I beg you, walk away from the keyboard for 48 hours; calm down and see whether you still feel the same way at the end of that time.

You have invested too much here for it to end on a sour note.
 
flemingovia:
Roman, we have been side by side here since some of this community were in infant school. I have no desire to see you walk away after so long, and no desire to see anyone end their time in TNP on a sour note.

You have given hundreds of hours to this region, in times of war and peace. I beg you, walk away from the keyboard for 48 hours; calm down and see whether you still feel the same way at the end of that time.

You have invested too much here for it to end on a sour note.
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I've just about had it with this sham of a government. It's a farce. The second you have an RL political disagreement with the political left, you get your head handed to you in a way that is intended to affect the play of the game.

People want democracy, yet they hand over power to those who would rule them rather than let them govern themselves.

The government touts free speech, yet those who run the IRC chat channel stamp on anyone they disagree with.

Who gets elected to office is just a matter of what clique happens to have enough people and who governs has nothing to do with competence or what is good for the region.

We've got Tim and Wham claiming that they speak for everyone from the Delegate to Great Bights Mum and we've got a Delegate who simply falls in line with those two because he lacks the spine to actually be Delegate.

There is no Executive authority in play and when the Delegate acts, its a matter of doing what a small minority wants instead of actually doing what is right.

In fact, dare I say, there is actually no government in TNP, just a handful of power-brokers who claim to exercise the will of the people of this region.

We've got people trying to recall the AG simply because they don't agree with him on game political items and because they want to have ultimate control by controlling the administration of the forum.

The only thing the current government is interested in is maintaining power over everyone else and using that power to suppress anything that resembles change. In the mean time, you have a clutch of people who use any excuse in the world to stamp on anyone who could possibly thwart their power-mongering.

And you are right, I have too much time invested in this region to simply walk away, but at the same time, I feel that it has been wasted time that has come to naught when I see RL political disagreements and the force of the dictatorship of Political correctness used as a tool to stamp the so-called 'Bill of Rights' and 'Constitution' of TNP. Again, both have proved to be a farce because you have people in government who ignore those principles for their own personal in-game political gain whenever they feel the need.

As of now, I am simply going to sit back and not assist the government at all. I am going to keep my RA status and membership in the SC, and that's it. I am going to sit back and watch this government put its foot in its own mouth and hope that things will change. And until things change, I will largely remain silent.


Lady Morgana:
Also, #tnp doesn't have 'freedom of speech' (nor, is the channel regulated by TNP Law)
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And there is my point. Freedom of anything in TNP is a farce under this government. We now have total and complete censorship and that doesn't even remotely sound like democracy or freedom. It sounds like hypocrisy. In fact, it is.

What you are supporting is the squashing of the basic human right of free speech. What you support is Poltical Correctness, that is, until you also fall victim to Political Correctness, which you eventually will.
 
Nobody has banned anybody for not having a leftist point of view. You were banned, as I understand, because of how you chose to put across your views. There are plenty of people who frequent #tnp who, I'm sure, have similar views to you, and they haven't been banned because they're aware of how inflammatory their views can be if they don't phrase carefully - -anybody-'s opinions can be inflammatory if not phrased carefully. It's a matter of how you act rather than what you think.
 
Romanoffia:
Lady Morgana:
Also, #tnp doesn't have 'freedom of speech' (nor, is the channel regulated by TNP Law)
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And there is my point. Freedom of anything in TNP is a farce under this government. We now have total and complete censorship and that doesn't even remotely sound like democracy or freedom. It sounds like hypocrisy. In fact, it is.

What you are supporting is the squashing of the basic human right of free speech. What you support is Poltical Correctness, that is, until you also fall victim to Political Correctness, which you eventually will.
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Wrong. We are tolerant of political beliefs (even if we do not agree with them). There's a fine line between free speech and speech which will offend and insult. We like the former, we do not like the latter, since it is done with the intention to offend and insult. Also, It's simple. Don't like how we run the channel? Don't join it.
 
No, you are only tolerant of beliefs and opinions that agree with your beliefs and opinions. All others are squashed.

Free speech is free speech regardless of whether or not someone is offended. What If I were Op on #TNP and something you said offended me and I banned you? Free speech is a farce when free speech can be silenced merely because someone is 'offended'. In that instance, free speech is a farce and you have a dictatorship, and that's what TNP is in this instance - a dictatorship in which free speech is only free if you agree with those who have the power to ban someone they disagree with.

And you, my dear, are a hypocrite and have no understanding of what 'Free Speech' means. Now, are you offended by my statement of opinion? Is being offended by an opinion grounds to silence that opinion? Your attitude is the foundation that totalitarianism is built on.

What you just said, Lady, offends me and I perceive it as being designed to insult and offend me. Therefore, under your own logic, you should be banned from this forum because you offended me. If you don't like it, you are free to not join the fourm. How do you like that application of your own logic?
 
We generally try to select OPs for #tnp who can be reasonable.

And I'm not sure the forum would tolerate things like being told to fudge off. (non-euphemistically)
 
This time you selected a couple of trolls for OPs and you know it. Why don't you stand up and do the right thing, like promoting free speech?

And, by the way, I received a fair amount of obscene abuse from Tim and others on IRC last night, but I guess the lynch mob that is TNP is more powerful than free speech, and you bowed to the lynch mob.

If we were to exclude anything we disagreed with from free speech protection, nothing would ever get said because someone would be offended somewhere by anything anyone said.

Funny, isn't it? Tim and Wham can tell me to fudge off (non-euphemistically) and if I do the same to them in response it's suddenly censorship for me? I call that dictatorship. And, unfortunately those little dictator types are part of the so-called government. It seems that free speech only consists of agreeing with the lynch mob.

Your choice of OPs in this instance was a foolish choice because they will drive away anyone that disagrees with them on any subject, and they will extend that to their roles in this government.
 
Oh, no. An injustice is an injustice and sitting back and taking it only invites more injustices.

This lynch mob mentality and bowing to the lynch mob has to be stopped.
 
You were temporarily banned -- by Wham, not Tim -- because you:

1) insulted and demeaned Indonesian culture;
2) generalized Jewish culture;
3) told Tim and others to "shut the feck up";
4) suggested that Earth was on drugs;
5) upon receiving a warning from Wham, who was trying to cool things down and prevent you from being banned, said "screw you" to him (this being the final act that caused the ban).

I personally would have perma-banned you from IRC if it had been my IRC, so I think you got off easy. IRC is supposed to be a community where people can feel casual and comfortable, not a free speech zone for Romanoffia to insult and offend whomever he wants with no repercussions. Stop whining and don't flush ten years in TNP down the toilet just because you spouted off and offended a bunch of people in IRC and got a 24 hour ban for it.

Obviously, I do not support the recall of the Delegate.
 
Great Bights Mum:
Hypothetically, if Elu were recalled today, wouldn't he be re-elected tomorrow? :tb1:
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Yes.

And that is why I support the recall.
 
Cormac Docherty:
You were temporarily banned -- by Wham, not Tim -- because you:

1) insulted and demeaned Indonesian culture;
2) generalized Jewish culture;
3) told Tim and others to "shut the feck up";
4) suggested that Earth was on drugs;
5) upon receiving a warning from Wham, who was trying to cool things down and prevent you from being banned, said "screw you" to him (this being the final act that caused the ban).

I personally would have perma-banned you from IRC if it had been my IRC, so I think you got off easy. IRC is supposed to be a community where people can feel casual and comfortable, not a free speech zone for Romanoffia to insult and offend whomever he wants with no repercussions. Stop whining and don't flush ten years in TNP down the toilet just because you spouted off and offended a bunch of people in IRC and got a 24 hour ban for it.

Obviously, I do not support the recall of the Delegate.
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I generalized the Jewish Culture? What, because I said I spent time in Israel and that I have some Jewish in me too?

And, I was being harassed via private chat by Tim who has a very nasty mouth by the way. You would have told him the same thing were you in my shoes.



"insulted and demeaned Indonesian culture;"?

How, by pointing out that Obama admitted eating dog meat when he was a child in Indonesia (in his book 'Dreams of My Father")? Or did I demean it by mentioning that Obama had anything to do with Indonesia.

And that was in response about Romney and his dog on the roof of the car. Funny, insult Romney with a factual statement and that's funny. Insult Obama with a factual statement is suddenly 'demeaning' to Indonesian Culture and not funny (even though Obama clearly stated that he did try dog meat as a child as a biographical fact).

It's a two way street. If you insult Romney you had better be equally tolerant of insults for Obama. The problem is that the lynch mob mentality is what went on there. Political conservatives constantly get harassed if they even breath on IRC and someone thinks they are conservative.




"suggested that Earth was on drugs;"?

A common turn of phrase used to denote that someone is out of touch with reality? Earth was being over-sensitive. There are some people who simply cannot get buy without finding offense at anything they see or hear.

If I complained every time someone said to me something like 'what are you smoking?' I wouldn't have time to pass wind.


And warned?

Tim kicked me from IRC once just because I criticized Obama as being incompetent. He opened a chat window and said as much. Then he harassed me non stop via the chat window he opened.

And I NEVER received any warning from anyone.

And as for free speech zone? You people tend to go about your merry way offending others who do not share your political beliefs and that's fine, but the second someone disagrees with yours, that's a different story and out comes the lynch mob.

The second Tim trolls me again on #TNP, I will demand that he get the same treatment I did. And he will troll me, I promise you.


And this thread has been hijacked and I request it be closed. This is no place for this type of RL discussion and I will not continue it.
 
[admin hat on] I have a request to admin from Roman asking to close this thread., which he opened

As I responded to the request in the Forum Operations Area:

I find this one a bit confusing, but I'll tell you what. I'll close it for now as a time out until the Speaker can review it and decide whether it should be left closed or reopened.

You've generated a lot of buzz kill in the last 18 hours or so, and I'm not sure what the overall moderator opinion is going to be with all of these different discussions.
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So for now, I'm closing this thread until the Speaker can get a handle on this and decide whether it should be open or kept closed. [/admin hat off]
 
As Grosse has said above, I've considered this thread and I've chosen to permanently lock it. This has degenerated into rude comments by Roman and additionally #TNP is not regulated by North Pacific law, and isn't even technically the regions property. Therefore this is not grounds for a recall - not that this appears to even be that, no formal recall motion has been made by Roman.

This looks to me to just be one of Romans half a dozen rants against Eluvatar, and has not got any business to be here.

Therefore, I must lock this.
 
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