FD: Amendment to Law 22

Then we'll have to agree to disagree, because having twenty different writing styles in the law also creates confusion and creates loopholes....which is why it's taken 5 years to clean up the mess that the adoption of the current Constitution created. And since you weren't here for any of it, being a newly minted member of the R.A. as you are.

As far as I am concerned the bill is ready to go to a vote, and I won't be accepting any further changes as the sponsor. So, Mr. SPeaker , let's get on with a vote, please.
 
Grosseschnauzer:
As far as I am concerned the bill is ready to go to a vote, and I won't be accepting any further changes as the sponsor. So, Mr. SPeaker , let's get on with a vote, please.
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I object. As you know perfectly well, I have requested a legal opinion from the Attorney General in regards to this amendment, and we are still waiting to hear back. Although the request was made almost a month ago, the court has clearly been occupied with a variety of matters.

The last communication I have received on the status ( http://forum.thenorthpacific.org/topic/6824862/1/ ) suggested that they were deliberating privately.

Their decision will inform my vote, and may be of interest to other RA members.
 
Grosseschnauzer:
Then we'll have to agree to disagree, because having twenty different writing styles in the law also creates confusion and creates loopholes....which is why it's taken 5 years to clean up the mess that the adoption of the current Constitution created. And since you weren't here for any of it, being a newly minted member of the R.A. as you are.
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And this bill closes none of those loopholes for the reasons I've already explained. Saying you can apply such and such a law will do nothing if the law doesn't exist. And if such law did exist, then saying it was applicable would be redundant since, if the law is properly written, it will already be ipso facto applicable. And even if the proposal did actually do something, that previous law is poorly written is no justification for continuing to use excessively long and obfuscating language when simpler constructions would carry equal legal force.

I also rather dislike the sentiment that just because I have not been in the RA for a long time, and because I wasn't personally there for when previous laws were written, my ideas somehow count intrinsically for less. I am perfectly capable of looking at the generously provided records of the law as it currently stands, there's no reason I had to be there to understand the law as it is.
 
I can't help but observe that a whole bunch of Taijitu natives and some of their allies have been joining the Regional Assembly, plotting to take over our judiciary and have been generally obstructionist ever since I became a candidate for Delegate. Blue Wolf for Attorney General? Really? Perhaps the least qualified name ever nominated for that office.

Seems to me the Taijitu folk did something similar when I was serving as Prime Minister under the last Constitution. Same tactics, too. Probably many of the same faces, too. Just an observation. And is it a coincidence that Limitless Event was such a fan of theirs as well? Hmmmm.

So as root admin, I will state this. Limitless Event created his own problems back when. Sneaking back onto the forums when he knew he was permanently banned is grounds to never allow any consideration of his current status now. He shouldn't have the access he does have. I should have put him back in the Banned group where he belongs since that was a decision made by my predecessors as root admin here. But back in the spring, I offered to give him a chance to show to the moderation team why he should be taken off the banned status based on his subsequent behavior since the permanent, ban was imposed by Hersfold before his retirement. It took months and repeated statements from eme for him to even request a review. By then we were headed into the elections last month.

Once we have the judicial elections and the special election over with, (and the three appointments are made for interregional, communications and general affairs) the moderation team, including those elected to office by then who have mod status over governmental areas of the forum, will review and decide on Limi's application concerning his ban. The more obstructionist y'all continue to be, the slower that review is going to be because people have to be in place first.

Keep it up, and I may go looking for Tresville.
 
Grosseschnauzer:
I can't help but observe that a whole bunch of Taijitu natives and some of their allies have been joining the Regional Assembly, plotting to take over our judiciary and have been generally obstructionist ever since I became a candidate for Delegate. Blue Wolf for Attorney General? Really? Perhaps the least qualified name ever nominated for that office.

Seems to me the Taijitu folk did something similar when I was serving as Prime Minister under the last Constitution. Same tactics, too. Probably many of the same faces, too. Just an observation. And is it a coincidence that Limitless Event was such a fan of theirs as well? Hmmmm.

So as root admin, I will state this. Limitless Event created his own problems back when. Sneaking back onto the forums when he knew he was permanently banned is grounds to never allow any consideration of his current status now. He shouldn't have the access he does have. I should have put him back in the Banned group where he belongs since that was a decision made by my predecessors as root admin here. But back in the spring, I offered to give him a chance to show to the moderation team why he should be taken off the banned status based on his subsequent behavior since the permanent, ban was imposed by Hersfold before his retirement. It took months and repeated statements from eme for him to even request a review. By then we were headed into the elections last month.

Once we have the judicial elections and the special election over with, (and the three appointments are made for interregional, communications and general affairs) the moderation team, including those elected to office by then who have mod status over governmental areas of the forum, will review and decide on Limi's application concerning his ban. The more obstructionist y'all continue to be, the slower that review is going to be because people have to be in place first.

Keep it up, and I may go looking for Tresville.
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A whole bunch?

Pardon my french but what planet do you live on?

There have been three (3) Taijituans excluding myself who have recently applied and been accepted in the Regional Assembly. I think you can name one of them. Two of them were in the North Pacific long before they were ever in Taijitu (or the Lexicon for that matter).

How many non-Taijituans recently joined the Regional Assembly?

And what 'allied to Taijitu' region are they from, exactly?

Certainly there are a number of RA members in the ProP. Specifically:

1. Eluvatar
2. Gulliver
3. Dalimbar (Dali)
4. Whamabama
5. A Mean Old Man (AMOM)
6. Haxstree
7. Felasia
8. Greater Peterstan
9. Grimalkin (Agamemnon)
10. Blue Wolf II (Blue Wolf)
11. Dyr Nasad (Dyr)
12. Oliver

Of these members I see 3 Taijituans, one quarter of the party. I also see 4 people who I believe were involved in Equilism. I also see that 4 of the members are involved with the UDL and at least 2 of the members are of an invader alignment. What these members all have in common is TNP involvement, not some other outside connection. 5 of the members have gotten involved in Gameplay since 2008, much less 2006. I expect a majority were not involved in Gameplay in 2006.

And I will note that I have carefully worked to ensure that no person has more than one RA membership. If someone got past me, they are doing something that shouldn't be possible or they work for an ISP.
 
People disagreeing with you does not a conspiracy make, Grosse . Also, I don't see how any of that was really related to this proposal.
 
I object, again.

I am probably one of the only Citizen's of TNP who has only one nation, has only ever had one nation, and whose nation has been a resident and active participant in the TNP from the moment of its inception. (Admittedly, it wasn't all that long ago :yes: ).

So, first, any attempt to characterize any of my actions as part of some foreign conspiracy is highly ridiculous - and speaks more about your attitude towards working collaboratively with others than about anything we are doing or saying.

Second, even though my nation may be born-and-bred-and-bleeding TNP, I am concerned with your xenophobic attitude towards nations that have joined us from elsewhere, since surely that makes up a overwhelming majority of active TNP citizens. So what if some TNP nations come from Taijitu? They come from lots of places. Good ideas come from lots of places too - especially since there is very little to be found amongst the old guard here.

Third, I, for one, have never engaged in deliberate obstructionism of any kind. I defy you to find an example of an objection I have raised that wasn't grounded in a logical analysis of the existing legal framework. Ensuring that elected officials follow due process of law does not count as obstructionism. Nor does collaborating with like-minded nations to promote positive change.

Fourth, I had (and have) no intention of deliberately engaging in some kind of political confrontation with anyone - individually, or from within my Party. However, if it your intention to engage with us on basis, we have the numbers, and plenty of legal and proper means of making our voices heard. We don't need to "plot" to be powerful. That is the purpose of acting collectively.

Fifth, with all the ranting and wild accusations - you're acting like a bit of a paranoid asshole. Not becoming of a freshly minted Delegate.
 
You're absolutely right, Gross. Taijitu is slowly but surely taking over TNP to use it for their own interests. As is LWU, the UDL, the NPO, Unknown, the Crimson Order, the FRA, TSP, the "native" TNPers (really alien space slugs wearing rubber human suits), Maxtopia, Limi the Outlaw (soon to be an animated series on Cartoon Network), and everyone else who has secretly inserted agents into your government to come together in these forums to impose their will upon you and turn this region which you are the one true king by blood right of into a dictatorship controlled by WAGA gnomes and their overlord, King Hrothgar of Haerot. The dictatorship will then be crushed by flying monkeys with flyswatters because its Court was usurped by the dark forces of Blue Wolf II who nominated himself for the position of AG and has, so far, been supported by only one other RA member out of almost thirty.

All this I have seen, as you yourself have also seen in the same fashion, in a vision sent to me by the divine lord Franco and his Virgin Mary [violet] who sent her son Kurdazistan to this world to show us the way of the holy. Unfortunately, we have killed Kurdazistan, hung him high above the sand on a cross marked "DoS," and will be punished for it through the destruction of TNP by all of these foreign forces which want it destroyed.

And so, without further ado, let us vote.
 
I vote Nay due to the unaddressed objections I already presented, as well as a stylistic issue with plurals in the first insert.

I would be happy to support a revised version of this bill.
 
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