DISCUSSION: TNP vs Matt

There is a difference between constructive criticism and disrespect. I frankly think the governance is wasting its time here and could be something more productive. I mean, I'm all for this trial continuing once we stabilize the new government, because there is some interesting discussion, but now is probably not the time.

Of course, a tyrant like you would not understand the difference.

OOC: I'm not ribbing you Pier, just your IC persona,which is pure evil. :P You have a bit of a point, and I do apologize to my colleagues if I offended.
 
Pierconium:
OOC:

"Police" are a defined government entity in US jurisdictions charged with enforcing the law, etc. etc.

Please feel free to point out in the Constitution where the forum Admins are granted the right to enforce IC law and I will accept your point.

Since no such clarification exists you are mixing metaphors and therefore post in error.
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It stands, then, that if I show that if the TNP Constitution authorizes ministries to use admin powers for any area related to citizenship or membership in the forum, then admin actions are executive actions and thus your objection becomes moot. Sorry if this is a little late, but here goes.

2 occasions during which the Admins must act as executives towards membership and citizenship:

Section 2. Registration.

In the interest of Regional security, member Nations shall be required to register prior to participation or voting in the Regional Assembly, as prescribed by the following procedures:

1) As used in this Section, or elsewhere in reference to this Section, “registration officials” refers to The Minister of Immigration and Internal Affairs, the Prime Minister, the Speaker of the Regional Assembly, the Court of the North Pacific, the Regional off-site forum administrators, and any other officials of the Regional Government deemed necessary to the registration and continuous eligibility procedures in this Section.

2) The registration officials are empowered to conduct investigations and make inquiries deemed necessary for the continuing enforcement of the member eligibility and other requirements for the Regional Assembly of The North Pacific as provided in this Constitution, The North Pacific Legal Code, or other laws enacted pursuant to this Constitution.
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3) Minister of Immigration and Internal Affairs.
A - The Minister shall be responsible for communicating with new member Nations, answering questions and highlighting regional procedures and guidelines.
B - The Minister shall be responsible for compiling domestic intelligence and enforcing Regional guidelines.
C - The Minister shall be responsible for overseeing the Regional Assembly registration process and procedures in conjunction and with the support of, the Prime Minister, the Regional off-site forum administrators, and other support personnel within the Regional Government, as designated by either the Prime Minister and/or the Cabinet of the North Pacific Regional Government.
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As they say in the old country, pwned.

This basically proves your argument pointless. First, they have to power to determine citizenship and membership. Secondly, this isn't even a legally arguable point because you're claiming that the administrators can't administrate. It doesn't even address the question of guilt or innocence on the part of your client.
 
I believe it is quite obvious how it could be interpreted, for example: 'Yet another failed trial. Emperor Matthuis for the win if legal procedure is followed'.
 
Or....


yet another international artists' collective (founded 1999) from Brooklyn, which puts on trial the letter "d" (presumably as an act of performance art). The European Movement will be victorious, if legal procedures for apiculture are followed.
 
Southwest Asia:
Pierconium:
OOC:

"Police" are a defined government entity in US jurisdictions charged with enforcing the law, etc. etc.

Please feel free to point out in the Constitution where the forum Admins are granted the right to enforce IC law and I will accept your point.

Since no such clarification exists you are mixing metaphors and therefore post in error.
Click to expand...

It stands, then, that if I show that if the TNP Constitution authorizes ministries to use admin powers for any area related to citizenship or membership in the forum, then admin actions are executive actions and thus your objection becomes moot. Sorry if this is a little late, but here goes.

2 occasions during which the Admins must act as executives towards membership and citizenship:

Section 2. Registration.

In the interest of Regional security, member Nations shall be required to register prior to participation or voting in the Regional Assembly, as prescribed by the following procedures:

1) As used in this Section, or elsewhere in reference to this Section, “registration officials” refers to The Minister of Immigration and Internal Affairs, the Prime Minister, the Speaker of the Regional Assembly, the Court of the North Pacific, the Regional off-site forum administrators, and any other officials of the Regional Government deemed necessary to the registration and continuous eligibility procedures in this Section.

2) The registration officials are empowered to conduct investigations and make inquiries deemed necessary for the continuing enforcement of the member eligibility and other requirements for the Regional Assembly of The North Pacific as provided in this Constitution, The North Pacific Legal Code, or other laws enacted pursuant to this Constitution.
Click to expand...

3) Minister of Immigration and Internal Affairs.
A - The Minister shall be responsible for communicating with new member Nations, answering questions and highlighting regional procedures and guidelines.
B - The Minister shall be responsible for compiling domestic intelligence and enforcing Regional guidelines.
C - The Minister shall be responsible for overseeing the Regional Assembly registration process and procedures in conjunction and with the support of, the Prime Minister, the Regional off-site forum administrators, and other support personnel within the Regional Government, as designated by either the Prime Minister and/or the Cabinet of the North Pacific Regional Government.
Click to expand...

As they say in the old country, pwned.

This basically proves your argument pointless. First, they have to power to determine citizenship and membership. Secondly, this isn't even a legally arguable point because you're claiming that the administrators can't administrate. It doesn't even address the question of guilt or innocence on the part of your client.
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You are incorrect.

If you actually read the entirety of the Constitution, the parts around what you quote, then you would note that notification must be provided to the nation being removed. No notification was provided, thus the Constitutional process was violated.

Your failed attempt has already been addressed earlier in the thread by one of the Admins, the same flaw was pointed out there. Please be up to date on the conversation before commenting and wasting our time.

What language do they speak in "the old country"? I do not recognize the word "pwned". Perhaps you mean owned? Or possibly NPOwned?
 
The Court and region should consider this matter closed.

The prosecutor has gone inactive, and was declare so when the ratification of the new Constitution was posted.

The Justice has been on extended absence due to health reasons.

The Trial proceedings have gone on for nearly two months, certainly not a speedy trial.

The Defendent has already left the region, and had his masking changed accordingly.
 
Yeah, when I started, my daughter could barely talk. Now she's in Kindergarten and I wonder how long till she wants her own nation.
 
My son started his nation first nation at age four weeks, and ran for delegate (as "Sir Andrew") at six months old.

He also regularly chats on IRC, and has done so since he was weeks old. True, he only hits the keyboard, but he still makes more sense than a number of people posting there.
 
In what manner, may I ask ? (I get an error when I try to view the TP forum, BTW)

IPS Driver Error
There appears to be an error with the database.
You can try to refresh the page by clicking here
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The server for the TP forum is having some issues.

What I refer to is the ruling passed down by Grand Inquisitor Pierconium just moments ago in the Courtroom. :)
 
Ah, I see. I must agree that the services of the PPI Legal Services were indispensible in providing defense council and an engaging legal debate. I tip my hat to them.

As I personally beleive that the Trial has come to a sadly inactive conclusion, thank you for the concuring opinion of the Grand Inquisitor.

Edit: And I hope that the server issues you are experiencing will soon be resolved.
 
Indeed. While I agree that this trial has dragged on for too long, The Pacific and its officials have no legal power here, and therefore no right to make any rulings.

If it was me, I would rule EM as being guilty and that proper punishment was already carried out by removing his citizenship. Maybe include a ruling barring him from ever applying to the RA or something as well, and call it a day.

In any case, Pierconium and Matthuis have no need to worry about whether this case is closed or not, since I doubt it will have any effect on anything.
 
Outer Kharkistania:
Indeed. While I agree that this trial has dragged on for too long, The Pacific and its officials have no legal power here, and therefore no right to make any rulings.

If it was me, I would rule EM as being guilty and that proper punishment was already carried out by removing his citizenship. Maybe include a ruling barring him from ever applying to the RA or something as well, and call it a day.

In any case, Pierconium and Matthuis have no need to worry about whether this case is closed or not, since I doubt it will have any effect on anything.
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I'll introduce you to an obviously foreign concept, its called "taking the piss"!! I suggest you google it and find out what it means, then you will take Pierconium's post in its intended context!! ;)
 
flemingovia:
This thread will be closed when a competent North Pacific authority asks for it to be closed.

Courts of the Pacific have no authority here.
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The Minister, former member of the Security Council, former member of the Regional Assembly, former Deputy Minister of Justice, former Minister of Justice, former Tyrant and Delegate of The North Pacific, has reached up with his dead hand and sign a writ of passage supporting the Judgement of Grand Inquisitor of Pierconium.

Since competence was a requirement we felt it best to dig him up instead of relying on the living.
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There's an awful lot of formers in that descriptions.
 
Outer Kharkistania:
flemingovia:
This thread will be closed when a competent North Pacific authority asks for it to be closed.

Courts of the Pacific have no authority here.
Click to expand...
The Minister, former member of the Security Council, former member of the Regional Assembly, former Deputy Minister of Justice, former Minister of Justice, former Tyrant and Delegate of The North Pacific, has reached up with his dead hand and sign a writ of passage supporting the Judgement of Grand Inquisitor of Pierconium.

Since competence was a requirement we felt it best to dig him up instead of relying on the living.
Click to expand...

There's an awful lot of formers in that descriptions.
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Indeed, and those are just for this region, which was always just a secondary project.
 
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