Confirmation of Gorundu as Election Commissioner

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The Delegate:
Noting that @Gorundu failed to take his oath for the position of Election Commissioner within seven days of his confirmation by the Regional Assembly on October 11th, and additionally that his term expired on October 16th, both leaving the position vacant, I hereby appoint @Gorundu as Election Commissioner, subject to a confirmation vote by the Regional Assembly.
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@Gorundu has been appointed to serve as an Election Commissioner by Delegate @Kaschovia. I hereby open the floor for debate and discussion on the nomination. I would welcome a statement in support of the nomination from the Delegate.

Should this reach a vote, I intend to put the following motion before the Regional Assembly:
Motion:
The Regional Assembly, acting on the nomination of the Delegate, appoints Gorundu to the Election Commission.
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It does raise concern does gor want this even? If so is there a reason he didn’t post an oath?
 
I agree with Hulldom. Gorundu appears to be more interested in engaging petty spitting matches with fellow-region mates in Discord than in being productive. Which is his right, mind you; but this is pathetic. Clearly we shouldn’t just rubber-stamp this, right?
 
I don't remember when this happened, but I think that the last time someone did this we reconfirmed them anyways.

My view on this is that the oath of office is a useless piece of overhead that should simply be scrapped altogether :P
 
Well . . . we obviously need a story from him. I will wait to see if there is any important missing context before I make a judgement.
 
If he can't make a simple forum post within the seven days allotted to him, then I have a hard time believing that he'll be around to potentially challenge incorrect ballots within six hours of a voting period's conclusion. In addition, I don't exactly appreciate how he's seemingly wasted the Regional Assembly's time by (presumably) agreeing to his initial appointment, having us all vote on it to confirm him, and then failing to follow up.

No support.
 
Hi @Gorundu. First off, I'd like to get on record that I believe you are a capable ECer and have done a good job so far. I'm certainly not the only one who has maintains that opinion. However, discussion about your activity issues has sprung up again. Following your successful confirmation, you failed to take your oath in the 7 days provided to you, and your term has lapsed as a result - my fellow TNPers see this as an issue, and as a result, you are not fit to serve them. I, for one agree and the fact is it is concerning that one of our government officials who is responsible for doing their job and responding in a timely manner could not take their oath over a pretty decent amount of time.

What do you have to say about this? Can you alleviate our concerns and prove that you won't let your lack of activity get in the way of performing your roles in our government? I for one, would really like to know.
 
Sil Dorsett:
Fregerson, earlier this year.
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That's what I thought, yeah. I also recall that Tlomz lost his citizenship one time and we were all like "lol, what a funny mistake, anyway here's your SC chair back." So, I'm not going to be the one to uphold a double standard here.
 
Robespierre:
If he can't make a simple forum post within the seven days allotted to him, then I have a hard time believing that he'll be around to potentially challenge incorrect ballots within six hours of a voting period's conclusion. In addition, I don't exactly appreciate how he's seemingly wasted the Regional Assembly's time by (presumably) agreeing to his initial appointment, having us all vote on it to confirm him, and then failing to follow up.

No support.
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Seconded. No support from me either.
 
I can't help but notice the difference between Fregerson's reconfirmation thread following him not taking the oath, and this one. Gorundu is judged here as not fit to serve, his mistake presumably as pathetic, and having wasted the Regional Assembly's time for the same error, even before he has offered additional context or comments to clarify. I stated in the first confirmation thread my support for Gorundu based on his long term experience not just within the EC, but in multiple high level positions, factoring in his contributions and willingness to serve our community - in my estimation those are valuable and relevant merits. I understand the concern that arises when an oath is not taken and I see where such arguments are rooted, but this reaction feels unnecessarily and distinctly harsh in comparison.
 
I think the difference, Kasch, is that Freg's error was easy to dismiss as an honest mistake. He was still active, even submitting admin requests the day before the timer ran out. If you look, the post right before I submitted the admin request indicating that he didn't post the oath in time was Freg asking for a WALL archive. Gorundu, on the other hand, has a reputation, earned recently, of being generally absent. He was removed as Delegate for it. It's not quite apples to apples here.
 
Don't get me wrong... I will vouch for Gorundu as doing a fine job as an Election Commissioner. He was even Chief for four months when I stepped aside. And, it's not like the job requires every-day attention. There's bursts of needed activity, and supervisors do need to act with reasonable precision in scheduling the various stages of the election.

The question now is... is Gorundu still up for that, or did his recall and then subsequent election loss leave a bad taste in his mouth to where he's just not into TNP government anymore, or is there something else going on? I really want to see a response from Gorundu. I think the questions are fair, and I'm willing to take the answers at face value.
 
I understand and acknowledge that the situations differ, but what I take issue with is the way the criticisms have been raised so literally. Not taking the oath in a timely manner has been equated to being unfit to serve, which was never an argument raised in Fregerson's reconfirmation thread, that is if the proponents of such a criticism believe it should be raised equally across the board and in retrospect. The error has been labelled as pathetic and characterized as a waste of the Regional Assembly's time, both criticisms which, if they are correct in their evaluation, should be applied equally by their proponents as well, which they were not. However, I do agree that further clarification from Gorundu regarding these concerns is going to be important.
 
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This was my mistake completely, and I apologise to the RA for yes, wasting their time. As some of you might have noticed, I've been somewhat less active recently, mainly because I'm under a bit of stress trying to make RL plans for next year. I remember receiving the ping about the conclusion of the vote, but as I was busy at the time I didn't do it immediately and ended up forgetting about it. Usually I would remember these type of things naturally after a few days, but in this case I just had a lot of things on my plate that I didn't think about it. Kasch was kind enough to offer to re-nominate me, and I hesitated a little bit to accept the offer because I had the feeling precisely that this sort of argument would happen. But the reason I accepted was that we are coming into an election, and I believe it is in the interest of the region to have an experienced Commissioner available.

As others have noted, this is an issue that has occurred before with Election Commissioners, and with Security Councilors as well, who were all eventually re-confirmed. I also do not believe that my tenure as Delegate should have anything to do with my ability to do my job as an Election Commissioner. We have had several elected officials who had resigned or were even recalled due to inactivity or performance reasons, who were later elected to even higher roles. I'm not asking to be Delegate again. I'm only asking to continue serving in the Election Commission as I have done faithfully over the last 2 years. Those who have served with me on the Election Commission in the past should know that I have been attentive in the elections where I have not been a candidate.
Bobberino:
I agree with Hulldom. Gorundu appears to be more interested in engaging petty spitting matches with fellow-region mates in Discord than in being productive. Which is his right, mind you; but this is pathetic. Clearly we shouldn’t just rubber-stamp this, right?
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I very much object to this characterization. I haven't been engaging in "petty spitting matches". I engaged in debate with Dreadton on our court system as many other citizens have done. I don't see how it is petty or any different from anyone else who has been arguing with Dreadton on the same subject.

To end, I want to thank Kasch for offering to renominate me and subsequently defending me in this thread when he could have very much taken the easy way out and left me in the dust. This speaks volumes to his character.
 
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I'm saying this in my capacity as a private citizen of the North Pacific and not as the Speaker of the Regional Assembly.

I think it's a bit unfair how you guys have acted toward Gorundu. Sure, he may have failed to post his oath within the allotted time of a week, which is a bit embarrassing, I'll admit, but you didn't have to be this harsh. I echo everything Kasch said. Gorundu has the experience and the evidence to show that he is fit to serve and that he is willing to serve. I'm asking you all to give him a bit of your patience and give him a second chance at serving the region in this capacity. I'm sure he'll be able to post his oath the second time around.

I am not defending inactivity. I am simply asking you all to give him another chance to prove himself.

I also once again reiterate the first sentence of this post.
 
Forgetting to post an oath for EC is not a deal breaker. We have someone with experience who wants to serve. That's good enough for me.
 
That's another case, interesting. A few questions from my side

You have forgotten to post the Oath in 7 days. Everybody forgets and that's just human, and to be honest, I really don’t mind that as big of an issue. I am rather wondering if it’s something to expect again? Or in another words, if it’s a bad omen for your activity? Especially regarding your Real-Life. Can we expect further issues in Real-Life (which would not generally be a problem at all), but especially during the election period?

I would also like to avoid any connections to your delegacy. Surely, it started with a lack of activity, but the general activity doesn’t really matter in that regard. I am once again asking, how you will handle the fast reactions required when supervising an election? And if there the activity might be a problem.

You were of course active on Discord and are not generally lacking activity. I do completely believe you just accidentally forgot it. Does it in any way show your current level of interest for that position?
Also, you said that you bring experience to the EC, so can you briefly summarize your past as an ECer, and point out the experience that differentiates you from the others?
 
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I too support the motion. This is simply a mistake that any one of us is possible to make. Sure Gorundu should make improvements and be mindful of the technicalities and fast reactions involved in the job, but Election Commissioner is a job that really only requires activity in election periods, and so far we have not seen any failure by Gorundu to do so. I condemn any attempt to draw comparison to the delegacy, as judging someone in hindsight tends to be quite unhelpful and unfair in these situations. I hope the RA can recognise Gorundu’s human error and continue to support their tenure as Election Commissioner.
 
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Had the pleasure of meeting Gorundu at a community event once. He was surprisingly down to earth, and VERY funny.

For that reason, I support the motion.
 
I mean, if Gor didn't care for the region and want to serve in this role it would be much easier to not go through another confirmation.

I'm willing to support.
 
Lionsmeow:
That's another case, interesting. A few questions from my side

You have forgotten to post the Oath in 7 days. Everybody forgets and that's just human, and to be honest, I really don’t mind that as big of an issue. I am rather wondering if it’s something to expect again? Or in another words, if it’s a bad omen for your activity? Especially regarding your Real-Life. Can we expect further issues in Real-Life (which would not generally be a problem at all), but especially during the election period?

I would also like to avoid any connections to your delegacy. Surely, it started with a lack of activity, but the general activity doesn’t really matter in that regard. I am once again asking, how you will handle the fast reactions required when supervising an election? And if there the activity might be a problem.

You were of course active on Discord and are not generally lacking activity. I do completely believe you just accidentally forgot it. Does it in any way show your current level of interest for that position?
Also, you said that you bring experience to the EC, so can you briefly summarize your past as an ECer, and point out the experience that differentiates you from the others?
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I don't think what has happened in this instance is an indication for my activity in the future. In any case, Election Commissioner isn't a taxing job by any means, and even if I'm busy I would still be likely to find the time for it during election periods. What happened this time was me forgetting a formality, and one that other people have forgotten about too in the past - sometimes when you get used to this sort of formality you tend to become complacent and forget it exists. Election time is a very different scenario, and I don't see myself forgetting how to do my job during an election.

As for your second paragraph about "fast reactions" - I would say running an election isn't about being fast, it's about being timely and methodical. An election supervisor would have to have a clear schedule on when to open and close each phase of the election, and they must do all these tasks without error. Tracking the votes is the most time-consuming part of the job, but if you record the votes regularly then it shouldn't feel like it's taking too long and you'd be less prone to making mistakes. If you're not supervising a particular election, then the job is mostly about what happens at the end, as Election Commissioners have a collective responsibility of ensuring the votes are counted correctly. This is of course where things have gone wrong in the past, at least part of which is because of the short six-hour window before an election can be certified. For me, living in a completely different time zone to most people on the Commission, that sometimes meant the entire period went by while I was sound asleep. Hopefully extending this period will be a change the Election Commission can agree on in the near future, as discussions have already occurred on this issue but has stalled recently due to other issues taking precedence for a lot of the Commissioners.

Finally, on experience, I have served more or less consecutive on the EC for two years now, including a stint as Chief Election Commissioner, which means I was the only person on the Commission, other than Sil (who is currently serving), who has served in that position. I'm very well-versed with the EC rules, I'm knowledgeable on the spreadsheet and the templates that we use (including stuff that is outdated), and while CEC I had to look over the shoulders of a few new Election Commissioners as they ease into their job, so I know a lot of the common pitfalls. That's about it, I have to say. There's not a whole lot you can do on the EC to distinguish yourself.
 
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Motion and Second recognized. A vote has been scheduled to begin at (time=1698262200)
 
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