Proposal for WA voting policy

Flemingovia

Flemingovia

TNPer
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I propose a completely alternative approach, which does not consider TNP as a direct democracy but as a representative Democracy.

Section 6.7: WA Voting Regulation Act:
35. The Delegate may vote on all World Assembly (WA) resolutions as they see fit, using any method to determine their vote as they decide.
Click to expand...

Before folks kick off, this is an absolutly serious proposal.

It simplifies the "where is your WA nation" issue. The delegate can decide whose voice (s)he listens to, and whether they take a vote, a straw poll, a chat on irc or any other method to decide.

If we do not like the way the delegate is deciding how to votie on WA issues - we vote them out. If we feel they are representing interests other than those of TNP - we recall.

In fact, i expect it would become a standard question in campaigning: "How will you decide how to vote on WA issues?"

The current debate turns the delegate into not much more than a puppet, pulling the voting lever as they are directed. My proposal recognises that they are a leader.
 
flemingovia:
I propose a completely alternative approach, which does not consider TNP as a direct democracy but as a representative Democracy.

Section 6.7: WA Voting Regulation Act:
35. The Delegate may vote on all World Assembly (WA) resolutions as they see fit, using any method to determine their vote as they decide.
Click to expand...

Before folks kick off, this is an absolutly serious proposal.

It simplifies the "where is your WA nation" issue. The delegate can decide whose voice (s)he listens to, and whether they take a vote, a straw poll, a chat on irc or any other method to decide.

If we do not like the way the delegate is deciding how to votie on WA issues - we vote them out. If we feel they are representing interests other than those of TNP - we recall.

In fact, i expect it would become a standard question in campaigning: "How will you decide how to vote on WA issues?"

The current debate turns the delegate into not much more than a puppet, pulling the voting lever as they are directed. My proposal recognises that they are a leader.
Click to expand...
I agree. Binding the Delegate to vote as directed by some kind of arbitrary means essentially means that the Delegate is essentially allowed to abdicate authority on certain mechanical functions of the Delegate.
 
It is the delegate's vote to cast. That (s)he consults at all is a courtesy. Who they consult is up to them.
 
So I am seeing two alternative approaches to this issue: Cormac's proposal and my proposal. If either is to be adopted, which would the RA prefer?
 
flemingovia:
So I am seeing two alternative approaches to this issue: Cormac's proposal and my proposal. If either is to be adopted, which would the RA prefer?
Click to expand...
Obviously, I still prefer my proposal. However, given that this proposal has now been legitimately adopted at the executive level (Govindia's claims of illegitimacy notwithstanding) I don't see a need for it to be legislated. I'm fine with letting this be an issue for electoral campaigns and letting the people decide which candidates have the better approach to WA voting.
 
flemingovia:
I propose a completely alternative approach, which does not consider TNP as a direct democracy but as a representative Democracy.

Section 6.7: WA Voting Regulation Act:
35. The Delegate may vote on all World Assembly (WA) resolutions as they see fit, using any method to determine their vote as they decide.
Click to expand...

Before folks kick off, this is an absolutly serious proposal.

It simplifies the "where is your WA nation" issue. The delegate can decide whose voice (s)he listens to, and whether they take a vote, a straw poll, a chat on irc or any other method to decide.

If we do not like the way the delegate is deciding how to votie on WA issues - we vote them out. If we feel they are representing interests other than those of TNP - we recall.

In fact, i expect it would become a standard question in campaigning: "How will you decide how to vote on WA issues?"

The current debate turns the delegate into not much more than a puppet, pulling the voting lever as they are directed. My proposal recognises that they are a leader.
Click to expand...
This is just so sensible. And simple. I like it.
 
If it receives a seconder, I feel my proposal at least is worth enshrining in the laws. It ought to be specified that the delegate may use any method they wish to determine their vote. I can forsee a future where a delegate might decide not ot consult, only to have various people banging on in the courts how they are not being shown respect and have a right to vote.

Mentioning no names.
 
Although I don't necessarily disagree with leaving this as executive policy for a variety of reasons, I also find this proposal unnecessary to legislate.

This policy has already in a sense been legislated by the absence of laws -- the Delegate already has the power to do what this legislation would empower the Delegate to do, and only a new law would remove that power. I'm generally opposed to unnecessary legislation and I would consider this extremely unnecessary.
 
I agree with Cormac.


Kingborough:
I see this as simply preventing people legislating to remove those powers of the delegate.
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It doesn't really do that either. People would simply have to amend this section/repeal it if they wanted to change the delegates powers in that regard.
 
Kingborough:
I see this as simply preventing people legislating to remove those powers of the delegate.
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It would perhaps make it more difficult to legislate, but if a majority of TNP were in favor of legislating a change they could just repeal this. And if a majority weren't in favor of legislating a change, a change wouldn't be possible anyway -- with or without this legislation.

Flem has noted that this legislation would remove the option of going to Court over the WA voting policy, but I don't think that's the case. Someone could still argue that this legislation conflicts with the Bill of Rights, which was the argument made in the most recent Court petition.

So, again, I feel that this legislation is unnecessary.
 
i am unconvinced, perhaps because I know of old the tendency for some in this region to turn a custom into a right.

I would still prefer it to be spelled out that the delegate has the right to determine his/her vote by whatever means they deem fit.
 
flemingovia:
i am unconvinced, perhaps because I know of old the tendency for some in this region to turn a custom into a right.

I would still prefer it to be spelled out that the delegate has the right to determine his/her vote by whatever means they deem fit.
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You could simply file a civil case with the court of the north pacific to seek a declaratory judgement regarding the rights of the delegate to decide the WA vote of the region on resolutions, weighed against the rights of citizens of the region to vote or determine procedure of the same.

Just a suggestion. Things impossible shall be made possible.
 
:agree:

In case it hasn't been formally established, I move for this to be voted upon.

If the motion has already been made earlier, then I second / third it whatever.

The delegate serves (in WA matters) as the representative of how TNP WA nations and TNP citizens ffeel about an issue and their opinions / votes count.
 
Chasmanthe:
You could simply file a civil case with the court of the north pacific to seek a declaratory judgement regarding the rights of the delegate to decide the WA vote of the region on resolutions, weighed against the rights of citizens of the region to vote or determine procedure of the same.

Just a suggestion. Things impossible shall be made possible.
Click to expand...
There is a tendecy in TNP among some to treat rulings by the court as little more than opinions to be challenged at every turn. So going to the court is less secure than putting them in our laws.

Govindia:
The delegate serves (in WA matters) as the representative of how TNP WA nations and TNP citizens ffeel about an issue and their opinions / votes count.
Click to expand...

This ably illustrates my point about how the practice by one particular delegate rapidly becomes a sense of entitlement.
 
I second, third, etc this motion to a vote.

Once codified this will ensure that delegates are free to choose whichever process they desire.
 
I like the idea. What's the point of being a Delegate if you can't have exclusive decision making on at least one of the perks.
 
I've given this a bit more than 24 hours, so now it is time for this to go to a vote. Thank you for waiting, and sorry I didn't get this done earlier.
 
As a point of reference - I'm voting Aye because I believe that the delegate should choose but that does not mean I agree with the policy itself.

That said, I agree with the general logic behind the policy, I just don't know if the follow through achieves what it should
 
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