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Concerning the admittance of Ninhundland as a Third-Party Member, Haor Chall votes Nay. Concerning the proceeding of Draconics' Full Membership, Haor Chall votes Aye.

No, that's kind of the whole purpose of this exercise. Deputies would be govt officials but senior staff would not (allowing people to hold senior staff position(s) in different areas whilst serving as a minister or deputy).

Posted in 10KI. Sorry for the delay!

Agreed. So I don't think that in itself requires changes to Article 7 of the Constitution - although I'm still of the view that we should sort out the "government officials appointed by government officials" language. In terms of the Legal code amend for this, how about something like: 6...

Thanks, that's helpful. Taking onboard your points, I agree that the Delegate appointing Deputy Ministers is probably a simpler, and better, approach. Regarding to the changes to Clause 3 and 5, I sort of take your point but the purpose of those changes was just to rephrase the existing...

So, below are the collected amendments required for this. Any specific thoughts/suggestions on these proposals - @King SillyString @Artemis ? Note - I have taken the opportunity to reorder 7.1 as it makes more sense to me that way, it's not that relevant to the purposes of the bill so happy to...

Ah okay, thanks - I had missed that nugget in the election law. I take your point, but that's why I'm proposing that we enable both options - by making senior staff appointments exist which are not govt officials but also allowing the option of a "proper" deputy to be appointed as well. Quite...

This is the contradictory nature of the issue though, you say they're rarely exercising any power themselves and mostly serve as senior staff (so why not call an apple an apple?). But you then say about deputy ministers filling in for the minister temporarily (e.g. acting as a Deputy - as the...

On the question of Skanda, the representative from Haor Chall agrees with the Republic of Mouxordia. Haor Chall will support the membership of Draconics. However, the Majestic Twelve do not find the answers from Ninhundland so far particularly persuasive. Could the government of Ninhundland...

That should be the only option.

Well this is exactly the point - what you describe is the role that they currently carry out but that isn't really a Deputy and, accordingly, it should not be called such.

I was also a member once upon a time. I'm pretty sure Isimud/Janus was too and therefore well has the standing to do this.

Court Justice (select up to 3): Eluvatar | Lord Lore | Janus Would you like to reopen nominations? No

Draft Military Info: ++Military Forces of Haor Chall++ Service Branches: Haor Chall Navy, Haor Chall Air Force, Haor Chall Army, Haor Chall Coast Guard Headquarters: The Octagon, Xi Char Defence Budget: $141 billion (2.3% of GDP) Manpower Total Active Personnel: 441,500 By Service: Navy...

It is good to see the Gryphons return!

Yes, I'm still not clear why the dictionary definition is insufficient in this case. So, anyway, in addition to the above two amendments, the following section of the Legal Code would also be amended. In combination these changes would resolve this issue of properly accountable government...

Posted in 10k Islands.

I don't understand how there is no way for the Delegate to ensure consistency in reporting, just because it requires each EO to submit their own report? They're the Delegates ministers and the Delegate will know when the reports are due, surely its just basic leadership and management for the...

Well that would be the simplest option, but there was a lot of opposition to that. Also, it does seem reasonable to allow for a proper Deputy to be appointed as well. Good point, I was just keeping the terminology consistent with the previous version.

Personally I prefer the Wonderess/Artemis version. Although I can see the sense in removing the last sentence and moving it to the FOI section.

Well that's no fun...! :jack:

Simpler, yes. However, not particularly useful or accurate - it's what the current wording is (apart from the slight contradiction implied by the wording in 7.3-5). That is, unless you wanted in combination to make Deputies to Ministers appointed by the Delegate, as that would solve the issue...

It seems very odd that Deputy Ministers are not currently seen as government officials, which appears to have arisen due to people serving as DM and Deputy Speaker. The Constitution allows for exceptions in the Legal Code, to allow people to serve in more than one position and therefore it seems...