Faibuaizu Alliances Negations

Syrixia:
*ahem*
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(OOC: Funny, I don't remember Syrixia being invited to the negotiations...
Next time, please PM us instead, so that you don't have to post in a closed IC thread.)
 
*sends out bounty hunters to track down the Syrixian spies*

Should this alliance have some kind of badge or logo?
 
Our terms proposals are:

1)The each members of Faibuaizu Alliances have to establish embassies in each members of Faibuaizu Alliances.

2)Our nations should promote and maintain peace on a domestic and international scale, especially in each members of Faibuaizu Alliances. Also we shouldn’t declare a conflict with any other nations unless there are requests from any major nations.

3)We shouldn’t declare a conflict with each other, also we should protect each other from any conflicts (Members of Faibuaizu Alliances.). If we do then the suspense or break up of the alliances and treaty.

4) Each members of Faibuaizu Alliances to have bit of their influence in each members of Faibuaizu Alliances.

5)We should established a free trade agreement in our nations.

6)We should established a mutual cooperation in our nations.

7)We should established an intellectual property systems in our nations.

8)We should established a wildlife conservation agreement in our nations.

9)We should established a cultural cooperation in our nations.

Our non-terms proposals are:

1) The each members of Faibuaizu Alliances allowed to have a small part territory each members of Faibuaizu Alliances, to do anything is permitted by The Faibuaizu Alliances and built a military base on it. (Condominium). (Optional).

2)The each members of Faibuaizu Alliances allowed to military unlimited access to each members of Faibuaizu Alliances. (Optional.)

Anyway, there any more questions and other proposals or change to the proposals? If not then, let the vote begin for the terms and non-terms.

Also, we agreeing with we have the alliance as a close alliance but allowing to invited other nations to join.​

Your nation agreed with The Faibuaizu Alliances' terms and non terms: (Please vote and on hold:)

  • Aye:3 (1 invalid vote?).
  • Nye:1.
  • Abstain:0.

(The vote will end when all the members voted and when all the members have agreed to it. Also, you still can vote and change the vote until when its ended the vote.)
 
Nay, for the following reasons:

Proposal #1 should not even be listed if it is optional, as it is thus not a term for the alliance.

We cannot agree to Proposal #2. Our citizens are very private, and we restrict all non-dragon access to all but Klarliert, which is itself limited in what the humans may do. Wyssiria especially is holy ground, and must not be tread upon by humans, let alone militaristic humans.

We cannot agree to Proposal #4, as it does not require anything and is easily skirted by.

Only Proposal #4 lists punishment for breaking the terms of the alliance.

The language is unclear throughout.

Finally, we wish to protest the conduct of New Sekai, as they ask for any proposed changes to their proposals, yet they begin the vote before receiving feedback from the other nations. As well, they counted the vote of Nebula before voting was even opened.

Should these proposals fail, we would be glad to provide our own proposals, as considered by our leading legal experts.

(OOC: As well, #6 still makes no sense, and was never explained.)
 
I see that the first point is optional, i'm agree with that.

The second point need clarification, the unlimited military access may be graranted only by permission of the nation that requires it.

Aye.
 
Darcania:
Nay, for the following reasons:

Proposal #1 should not even be listed if it is optional, as it is thus not a term for the alliance.

We cannot agree to Proposal #2. Our citizens are very private, and we restrict all non-dragon access to all but Klarliert, which is itself limited in what the humans may do. Wyssiria especially is holy ground, and must not be tread upon by humans, let alone militaristic humans.

We cannot agree to Proposal #4, as it does not require anything and is easily skirted by.

Only Proposal #4 lists punishment for breaking the terms of the alliance.

The language is unclear throughout.

Finally, we wish to protest the conduct of New Sekai, as they ask for any proposed changes to their proposals, yet they begin the vote before receiving feedback from the other nations. As well, they counted the vote of Nebula before voting was even opened.

Should these proposals fail, we would be glad to provide our own proposals, as considered by our leading legal experts.

(OOC: As well, #6 still makes no sense, and was never explained.)
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Oh ok.

Yeah we now change the proposals again.

(OOC: Oh sorry, please can someone help me out here, to make it more clear?)

Yeah, we are sorry for that and we put the vote on hold but the members can still vote and change the vote until the voting ended. Aswell, we put Nebula vote as invalid so Nebula have to vote again.

Oh ok.

(OOC: Oh sorry, I thought I did explain and I thought you didn't know, you sure about agreeing or disagreeing do it, or you didn't understand it.)

6)We wishing do have influence over bit of everything (For example, internal policy, foreign policy and etc.), aswell we willing do the same for our nations.

(OOC: I'm hoping this now make sense.)
 
Nessuno:
I see that the first point is optional, i'm agree with that.

The second point need clarification, the unlimited military access may be graranted only by permission of the nation that requires it.

Aye.
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Ok then.
 
Nebula:
(Sorry about that)

We should probably just redraft it.
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(It's ok.)

We think, we should not because most of us understand it just Darcania doesn't understand it, because isn't clear. I think. Just wait for Darcania do respond.
 
Wolfsea, Nessuno and Nebula, can you help us out to make the proposals more clear for Darcania? Because Darcania don't really understand us.
 
Sooo... when are we gonna get this thing set in stone? I take it most of Darcania's questions have been answered?
 
Nebula:
Sooo... when are we gonna get this thing set in stone? I take it most of Darcania's questions have been answered?
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No, Sorry. I still not receive any response from Nessuno or Darcania?
 
After long and careful deliberation, we propose the following Treaty for this alliance, based off of the proposals of New Sekai, with added detail and clarity, and which addresses our previous concerns with New Sekai's proposals.

We would be glad to provide detailed explanations for any part of the below treaty. As well, New Sekai's proposals #8 and #9 were not included in the treaty, as we believe those terms would best be relegated to Proposals, as defined in the treaty below.

We encourage you all to examine this treaty closely, as dragons in general are not as proficient at drafting laws and treaties as humans are.

If any wish to refer to a specific clause in the below treaty without quoting it, they may refer to it by its section number or name, followed by a period or equivalent, then by its clause number. For example, clause 4 under the Defense section, "Members are encouraged to provide land to all other members for the use of a military base.", may be referred to as "V.4", "Defense-4", etc.

Faibuaizu Treaty:
Section I: Definitions
  1. Member: A Nation-State who has fulfilled all the requirements of membership, as listed below.
  2. Member in Good Standing: A Member which has not broken a Required term of this treaty, or who has been forgiven by proposal for previously breaking a Required term.
  3. Member Not in Good Standing: A Member which has broken a Required term of this treaty, but who has not had their membership revoked and who has not yet been forgiven by proposal.
  4. Non-Member: A Nation-State who has not fulfilled all the requirements of membership, as listed below.
  5. Required: Members breaking a Required term will face appropriate punishment as determined by this treaty. Proposals breaking a required term will be considered null and void.
  6. Encouraged: Members breaking an Encouraged term will face no punishment from this treaty, though other members may react accordingly within the bounds of this treaty.

Section II: Membership
  1. A non-member is required to have been invited into this Alliance by a member in good standing before being considered for membership.
  2. The inviting member is required to submit a proposal to this Alliance to accept the invited non-member.
  3. The proposal is required to pass with a two-thirds majority, at which point the invited non-member becomes a member.
  4. The five founders of this Alliance, New Sekai, Wolfsea, Nessuno, Nebula, and Darcania, are considered members upon the ratification of this treaty and subsequent formation of this Alliance.
  5. A member who has their membership revoked is considered a non-member, and is required to fulfill the above requirements again before they may become a member again.
  6. Any proposal which revokes the membership of a member is required to pass with a two-thirds majority.
  7. Members in good standing may propose to forgive a member not in good standing; upon such a proposal passing, the relevant member becomes a member in good standing. Such a proposal is required to pass with a simple majority to take effect.

Section III: Proposals
  1. Any member may submit a proposal to this Alliance.
  2. The proposal is required receive a majority vote of "Aye" for it to take effect, unless this treaty requires a two-thirds majority, in which case the proposal must receive a two-thirds majority vote of "Aye".
  3. Members are required to submit to the terms of the proposal when it takes effect.
  4. All proposals are subordinate to this treaty.

Section IV: Diplomatic Missions
  1. All members are required to establish permanent diplomatic missions with all other members.
  2. All members are encouraged to establish permanent diplomatic missions with any allies of other members.
  3. All members are encouraged to withdraw permanent diplomatic missions with any nations at war with other members.

Section V: Defense
  1. Members are required never to declare war on other members.
  2. Members are encouraged never to declare war on non-members.
  3. Any non-member at war with any member is required to cease hostilities with all members upon becoming a member.
  4. Members are encouraged to provide land to all other members for the use of a military base.
  5. Members are required to provide material assistance to any member at war with a non-member.
  6. Members are required to provide no material assistance to any non-member at war with a member.
  7. Any member at war with a non-member is encouraged to propose to this Alliance to declare war on that non-member.
  8. The proposal is required to pass with a two-thirds majority.
  9. In the case of civil war, the government or government-in-exile which fulfills the above membership requirements is considered a member, while any other government or government-in-exile of a member nation-state is considered a non-member.

Section VI: Espionage
  1. Members are required to inform any other members of any espionage activity in their respective nations.
  2. Members are encouraged never to spy on the government or people of any other members' nations.
  3. Members are required to share any intelligence they learn pertaining to any other member with that member.
  4. Members are encouraged to share any intelligence they learn with all other members.
  5. Members are required to share any intelligence they learn pertaining to this alliance with all other members.

Section VII: Extradition
  1. Members are required to extradite any criminals to other members upon request.

Section VIII: Free Trade
  1. Members are required to establish free trade agreements with all other members.
  2. Members are required to impose no tariffs, taxation, fees, or penalties on trade between member states, with the exception of military or rationed goods.
  3. Members are not required to apply this section to members not in good standing.

Section IX: Open Borders
  1. Members are required to allow free travel between and within member states by their respective citizens, excepting citizens who by law cannot travel.
  2. Members are encouraged to allow free travel between and within member states by their respective military.

Section X: Amendments
  1. Proposals which amend this treaty are required to pass by two-thirds majority.
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Darcania:
After long and careful deliberation, we propose the following Treaty for this alliance, based off of the proposals of New Sekai, with added detail and clarity, and which addresses our previous concerns with New Sekai's proposals.

We would be glad to provide detailed explanations for any part of the below treaty. As well, New Sekai's proposals #8 and #9 were not included in the treaty, as we believe those terms would best be relegated to Proposals, as defined in the treaty below.

We encourage you all to examine this treaty closely, as dragons in general are not as proficient at drafting laws and treaties as humans are.

If any wish to refer to a specific clause in the below treaty without quoting it, they may refer to it by its section number or name, followed by a period or equivalent, then by its clause number. For example, clause 4 under the Defense section, "Members are encouraged to provide land to all other members for the use of a military base.", may be referred to as "V.4", "Defense-4", etc.

Faibuaizu Treaty:
Section I: Definitions
  1. Member: A Nation-State who has fulfilled all the requirements of membership, as listed below.
  2. Member in Good Standing: A Member which has not broken a Required term of this treaty, or who has been forgiven by proposal for previously breaking a Required term.
  3. Member Not in Good Standing: A Member which has broken a Required term of this treaty, but who has not had their membership revoked and who has not yet been forgiven by proposal.
  4. Non-Member: A Nation-State who has not fulfilled all the requirements of membership, as listed below.
  5. Required: Members breaking a Required term will face appropriate punishment as determined by this treaty. Proposals breaking a required term will be considered null and void.
  6. Encouraged: Members breaking an Encouraged term will face no punishment from this treaty, though other members may react accordingly within the bounds of this treaty.

Section II: Membership
  1. A non-member is required to have been invited into this Alliance by a member in good standing before being considered for membership.
  2. The inviting member is required to submit a proposal to this Alliance to accept the invited non-member.
  3. The proposal is required to pass with a two-thirds majority, at which point the invited non-member becomes a member.
  4. The five founders of this Alliance, New Sekai, Wolfsea, Nessuno, Nebula, and Darcania, are considered members upon the ratification of this treaty and subsequent formation of this Alliance.
  5. A member who has their membership revoked is considered a non-member, and is required to fulfill the above requirements again before they may become a member again.
  6. Any proposal which revokes the membership of a member is required to pass with a two-thirds majority.
  7. Members in good standing may propose to forgive a member not in good standing; upon such a proposal passing, the relevant member becomes a member in good standing. Such a proposal is required to pass with a simple majority to take effect.

Section III: Proposals
  1. Any member may submit a proposal to this Alliance.
  2. The proposal is required receive a majority vote of "Aye" for it to take effect, unless this treaty requires a two-thirds majority, in which case the proposal must receive a two-thirds majority vote of "Aye".
  3. Members are required to submit to the terms of the proposal when it takes effect.
  4. All proposals are subordinate to this treaty.

Section IV: Diplomatic Missions
  1. All members are required to establish permanent diplomatic missions with all other members.
  2. All members are encouraged to establish permanent diplomatic missions with any allies of other members.
  3. All members are encouraged to withdraw permanent diplomatic missions with any nations at war with other members.

Section V: Defense
  1. Members are required never to declare war on other members.
  2. Members are encouraged never to declare war on non-members.
  3. Any non-member at war with any member is required to cease hostilities with all members upon becoming a member.
  4. Members are encouraged to provide land to all other members for the use of a military base.
  5. Members are required to provide material assistance to any member at war with a non-member.
  6. Members are required to provide no material assistance to any non-member at war with a member.
  7. Any member at war with a non-member is encouraged to propose to this Alliance to declare war on that non-member.
  8. The proposal is required to pass with a two-thirds majority.
  9. In the case of civil war, the government or government-in-exile which fulfills the above membership requirements is considered a member, while any other government or government-in-exile of a member nation-state is considered a non-member.

Section VI: Espionage
  1. Members are required to inform any other members of any espionage activity in their respective nations.
  2. Members are encouraged never to spy on the government or people of any other members' nations.
  3. Members are required to share any intelligence they learn pertaining to any other member with that member.
  4. Members are encouraged to share any intelligence they learn with all other members.
  5. Members are required to share any intelligence they learn pertaining to this alliance with all other members.

Section VII: Extradition
  1. Members are required to extradite any criminals to other members upon request.

Section VIII: Free Trade
  1. Members are required to establish free trade agreements with all other members.
  2. Members are required to impose no tariffs, taxation, fees, or penalties on trade between member states, with the exception of military or rationed goods.
  3. Members are not required to apply this section to members not in good standing.

Section IX: Open Borders
  1. Members are required to allow free travel between and within member states by their respective citizens, excepting citizens who by law cannot travel.
  2. Members are encouraged to allow free travel between and within member states by their respective military.

Section X: Amendments
  1. Proposals which amend this treaty are required to pass by two-thirds majority.
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Thank you for making it more detail and clear, aswell adding more to it.

I should tell you, we not all human. In fact, I'm a folf, a hybrid of a wolf and fox. I just telling you for future reference.

Anyway, we felt everything in the proposal is alright and there no need for change or adding more to it.

We will open the vote for this, soon as possible but after when Nebula reply to it.
 
Your nation agreed with The Faibuaizu Alliances' new terms: (Finished)

  • Aye:4.
  • Nay:0.
  • Abstain:1.

(The vote will end when all the members voted and when all the members have agreed to it. Also, you still can vote and change the vote until when its ended the vote.)
 
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