WMDs in TNP

The Spokesman of Eumenor

The Spokesman of Eumenor

TNPer
Addressing the DU,
There have been many recent examples of WMDs being unveiled for use in warfare. For example, Cronaal's superweapon, and Syrixia's bomb that briefly featured in 'An Interesting Letter'. I think we need to address the safety issues and humanitarian concerns raised by these objects in a new piece of legislation. Any thoughts?
 
Hmmm. Well personally I don't think we ought to forbid them, but maybe we could pass legislation that requires all DU nations to inform the DU of any developments regarding their stockpile & uses.
 
We in Syrixia disagree; that breaks the right of confidentiality. Though, we believe that WMDs should only be used when there is without a doubt no other way out of conflict.
 
The Commonwealth would concur with the assessment that the proliferation of weapons of mass destruction is an issue throughout our region. We are wholeheartedly against the possession of weapons of mass destruction on moral and ethical grounds, and believe that the DU should actively seek out a solution to curb their production and potential usage within the North Pacific.

I believe this will have to take multiple forms. I readily acknowledge that most nations are not going to be as willing to disband their programs, so I believe the first step should be that the DU internally makes a declaration about the limitation of strategic weapons. This leaves room for tactical nuclear stockpiles which can be used in a defensive nature, and allows for limited possession of a few strategic nuclear weapons. We should also consider banning chemical and biological weapons wholesale.

This can all be done through proclamation as opposed to hardened legislation. Thoughts?
 
Eumenor is in possession of a nuclear deterrent, but we are against the idea of a strategic WMD. Thank you for acknowledging the problem. I would be grateful if we could elaborate further on the legislation?
 
Full support, but what about the non-DU nations? What if they have more than what our limit allows and we can't do anything to stop them? By simply being in the DU, we're less safe incase a crazed nuclear dictatorship invades us.

Syrixia proposes we do not have limits but instead hold a class in TNP University or perhaps a workshop in this subforum on the best times and places to use WMDs, so every nation can use them RESPONSIBLY and yet still retains the freedom to use them.

Also, we REALLY need to work on banning chemical and biological weapons not just in the DU, but in all of TNP. They're ATROCIOUS.
 
I support banning biological and chemical weapons and therefore banning the use of them in combat, but I do not support the disarmament of WMDs in the DU or TNP. Perhaps getting rid of the weapons are not a problem, but protecting ourselves from them is. I do support the research of an advanced missile defense system for all nations within the DU to further protect the people of that country.
 
dmb615:
I support banning biological and chemical weapons and therefore banning the use of them in combat, but I do not support the disarmament of WMDs in the DU or TNP. Perhaps getting rid of the weapons are not a problem, but protecting ourselves from them is. I do support the research of an advanced missile defense system for all nations within the DU to further protect the people of that country.
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I am not advocating for the dissolution of any creation of missile defense. In fact, my country would prefer that nations actively seek this as an option if they have not already.

I do think this is a pertinent time to mention that my nation does have functioning (and fairly reliable) early warning and missile defense system, all of which is highly classified and has not been approved by my government to be released to even our closest allies. However, it is worth noting that should we believe a member of the Democratic Union is the target of one of these weapons, we would unilaterally invoke Article III of the Collective Defense Agreement to protect from such an attack.

My government has other countermeasures, but as you can imagine, I am not at liberty to discuss them.
 
Syrixia:
We in Syrixia disagree; that breaks the right of confidentiality. Though, we believe that WMDs should only be used when there is without a doubt no other way out of conflict.
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Since when is confidentiality a right granted by the Democratic Union? While our Sovereignty needs to be respected, we cannot be throwing up confidentiality every time something related to defence is discussed. This is keeping in mind that the DU is a collective body that will defend one another from attack. In addition to that, we have private chambers, which mean that any discolsure would only be available to member states. (OOC: this means that other nations could not RP with the knowledge of the weapons available, unless disclosed by the member state who is RPing with them - though some fairness should be included in all RP's).

I would support the creation of a body of representatives from 5 member states, appointed by the chairman, that could have powers of inspection and seizure when necessary. Similarly, measures that keep the DU informed of stockpiles of weapons should be considered. There

OOC: I think we also need some RP standards about an old large nation having the same WMD's as a new nation lol. But also some equality across the board.
 
The government of Plembobria does not possess chemical weapons of any kind. Our nuclear program has recently been shrunk due to the use of nuclear force by rogue members of our military.

The DU should deter the use of WMDs of all kinds, provided they allow member states to possess some kind of deterrent.
 
Scandigrad:
Nessuno:
Syrixia:
Why not the chemical weapons? Have you seen the ATROCITIES in Syria?
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Because we have chemical weapons!
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So does that make it right? What kind, and for what purpose does your nation have chemical weapons?
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Chemical weapons are atrocious, and are possibly, along with bio-weapons, the worst way for ANYONE to be KIA.

While nuclear weapons are acceptable if used responsibly, chemical and bio-weapons should definitely be banned.

That's Syrixia's assessment on the subject.
 
Syrixia:
Scandigrad:
Nessuno:
Syrixia:
Why not the chemical weapons? Have you seen the ATROCITIES in Syria?
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Because we have chemical weapons!
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So does that make it right? What kind, and for what purpose does your nation have chemical weapons?
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Chemical weapons are atrocious, and are possibly, along with bio-weapons, the worst way for ANYONE to be KIA.

While nuclear weapons are acceptable if used responsibly, chemical and bio-weapons should definitely be banned.

That's Syrixia's assessment on the subject.
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What are some "acceptable" uses of nuclear weapons?

What about tear gas? That's chemical warfare. Is it atrocious or irresponsible? White Phosphorous is used as a smoke screen on almost every single modern armored vehicle or tank, and is highly effective. But when used offensively, it is incendiary, and can burn cloth or even skin. Do the lifesaving capacities of it's defensive capabilities outweigh it's offensive capabilities?
 
Nessuno:
However to answer Scandigrad , we have 600000 Tabun bombs.
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600000?! What the hell do you expect to do with 600000 bombs worth of Tabun?!

Considering Tabun is a Schedule I chemical weapon, we are appalled by the size of your stockpile, and fail to see any situation in which it's use would be justified.

I will be convening with representatives within my government for an appropriate course of action, but you can expect some sort of statement seeking the removal of this stockpile.
 
Olvern deplores the usage of nuclear, biological, biochemical, chemical, or any other form of weaponry that is capable of causing great harm, such that it can be appropriately termed as a weapon of mass destruction. Such weapons should ideally be banned outright from use amongst DU nations, as its usage is arguably a war crime that is most deplorable and against the very foundations in which this body is founded upon. Having said so, Olvern is cognizant of the impossibility of such a ban being implemented outright. With that in mind, the limitation of existing WMD stock amongst DU members should definitely be pursued, and the ban on the unilateral usage of these weapons amongst member states of the DU should definitely be considered.

Olvern also condemns the current stockpile of chemical weapons claimed to be held by the Dispersi administration, and would strongly urge Territorio Di Nessuno to consider limiting its stockpile of WMDs, of any kind, immediately. On that note, Olvern recommends that an organisation, set up with the aim of investigating WMD stockpiles amongst DU nations, be opened, so that appropriate action can be taken for different situations.

(OOC: Is a stockpile of 600 thousand Grade I chemical bombs even realistic? I honestly do not know.)
 
These are remnants of war.

OOC: indeed i take this number from a book about nazi germany secret weapons, they really have 500000 chemical artillery schells and 100000 chemical bombs.
 
Lord Nwahs:
(OOC: Is a stockpile of 600 thousand Grade I chemical bombs even realistic? I honestly do not know.)
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OOC: The short answer is yes, because it is measuring munitions. Usually chemical weapon stockpiles are measured in metric tons, but 600,000 smoke grenades and ARTY shells does not amount to that much in actual chemical agent. If I had to take a wild guess at the claim (keep in mind this is ill informed and really a guesstimate), it probably accounts for under 5,000 metric tons of Taubin, but really depends on the delivery method. An ARTY shell is heavier than, say, a smoke grenade.

These are remnants of war.
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So is your nation doing anything to neutralize them? Or does your nation intend to maintain, or even expand this stockpile?
 
You are more than welcome to, but could you clarify what you are motioning to vote? Or are you planning to draft something?
 
Scandigrad:
So is your nation doing anything to neutralize them? Or does your nation intend to maintain, or even expand this stockpile?
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We mantain them, neutralize it's a risk for people and for enviromental.
We don't think to expand.
 
Scandigrad:
You are more than welcome to, but could you clarify what you are motioning to vote? Or are you planning to draft something?
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Voting on the creation of this board.
I think this body should have the power to demand of DU nations the full details of their armaments. It should then proceed to discuss with the nation in question what should be done - is the stockpile reasonable, and is it a threat to security? It would then have the power to disband the stockpile if it sees fit. But I am no good at writing legislation.
 
I would just say that on reflection, I do not think the board should have the authority to destroy or remove the stockpile itself. It should have the power to make recommendations for removal/destruction of the stockpile however.

OOC: Can create a more interesting RP environment that way.
 
I like the idea of a board, and if one is created, Guslantis would like to take part.
 
The Spokesman of Eumenor:
I agree McM, but then certain nations would never consider it. Maybe they should have power to impose sanctions?
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If they don't consider it, then the DU can remove them. We can impose trade sacntions, cripple their economy, and cause their people to starve to death in a mass famine. If necessary we can invade them to destroy their stockpile.
 
mcmasterdonia:
The Spokesman of Eumenor:
I agree McM, but then certain nations would never consider it. Maybe they should have power to impose sanctions?
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If they don't consider it, then the DU can remove them. We can impose trade sacntions, cripple their economy, and cause their people to starve to death in a mass famine. If necessary we can invade them to destroy their stockpile.
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OOC: Syrixia & Nessuno are so screwed.
 
The Spokesman of Eumenor:
mcmasterdonia:
The Spokesman of Eumenor:
I agree McM, but then certain nations would never consider it. Maybe they should have power to impose sanctions?
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If they don't consider it, then the DU can remove them. We can impose trade sacntions, cripple their economy, and cause their people to starve to death in a mass famine. If necessary we can invade them to destroy their stockpile.
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OOC: Syrixia & Nessuno are so screwed.
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:P

Luckily Aurora Orb is not too open about things regarding military capabilities. We know how to keep secrets :shifty:
 
The Spokesman of Eumenor:
Scandigrad:
You are more than welcome to, but could you clarify what you are motioning to vote? Or are you planning to draft something?
Voting on the creation of this board.
I think this body should have the power to demand of DU nations the full details of their armaments. It should then proceed to discuss with the nation in question what should be done - is the stockpile reasonable, and is it a threat to security? It would then have the power to disband the stockpile if it sees fit. But I am no good at writing legislation.
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I don't think that the DU should have the power to Demand possible confidential information on sensitive military technologies. I can support, however, regular inspections on the stockpiles that are in their possessions. The strong recommendations regarding the removal or destruction of bioweapons, chemical weapons, nuclear devices, and overall WMDs are something I can get my back behind. Sanctions, especially to nations where trade is a needed component to their economy should easily get the message out that the DU is not playing around and will be sure to back up their decision with cold hard action. The probationary status of member nations can also ward off nations whose economy will not be as effected as others. For Dalies, there is not a problem with revealing most information to the Democratic Union; I just do not believe that nations can be forced to give up this information nor can they be kicked out of the DU for withholding this information.


OOC: WMD are dangerous little buggers. Creating this conflict, I hope, is to kick-start an interesting RP motion that hopefully creates more conflicts in the future, especially regarding this matter :P
 
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